I've posted before about in-law care-giving. Aged mother in law, lives in same town.
We are at the tail end of a visit from sister in law from several states away. Sister in law has been here for 3 weeks caring for her mother. A much welcome respite.
It had been discussed, prior to her arrival here on the scene, she would be talking it over with her mother, to try and get her mom to come up to her home, for a stay of maybe a few months.
This, in my opinion, is absolutely essential, as I am expecting twin grand-children, due in about 1 month (if they don't come sooner, as is the case a lot of times with multiples pregnancies). The expectant mother also lives locally here, and has a 4 year old daughter. I will be on that front, helping .. as much as is needed. And not on the front with mother in law and care-giving, and have made that as obvious and apparent as I know how to make it. It would be great if mother in law would agree to go to her daughter's home (several states away) for a period of a few months .. and allow me the latitude to put my energies where I want them to be, on my daughter who will have had a c-section .. and my grand-daughter (4 years old) and new twin babies.
Nothing doing. Mother in law has dug in her heels, and will not hear of it, going to stay with her daughter for any period of time.
What are her reasons?
In mother in law's defense ... her daughter ... I don't even know how to describe it. I will say that when her daughter comes here to visit, she all but breathes for her mother and if she could find a way to do that, she'd do that too. She is the most nervous nelly, never sit down - ever ... worry wart, do everything, all the time .. person that I've ever encountered.
A great example, as I was taking her to the airport yesterday for her departure, . I reached into the fridge to grab myself a bottled water and shut the fridge and turned to walk away, as I've done for all of my 50 plus years living on this earth .. and she said to me, "Oh make sure that fridge shut". WTH???? Like I don't know how to shut a fridge? That's just a small, very small slice of what she is ... how she is.
She is so very hyper-vigilant, seeing to every minute details down to it's finest most minuscule point, fine tooth comb, questioning every point along the way, "should we do thus and so, but maybe if we do thus and so, then such and such will happen, maybe we should do it thus and so .. but then so and so might happen, maybe we shouldn't do thus and so, but do "x" "y" and "z" instead, but if we don't do it that way then ..........", on and on and on and on it goes. And usually in hyper warp speed, as to every single friggin thing.
If her mother moans .. "what's wrong mother?, why did you moan, are you alright?".
Mother: "Yes, I'm fine, I was just sighing out loud".
Sister: "Why did you sigh? Are you hurting, are you sure you're alright, why are you sighing what's the matter?"
Mother: "For God's sake __________________, I was just sighing, .. calm down, I'm fine".
Sister: "Are you sure, .. because if something is wrong you need to tell me".
Mother: "Everything is fine, I'm fine".
Sister: "Are you sure, we did a lot yesterday, did we do too much, maybe we shouldn't of gone to two doctors in one day .. was that too much for you, are you too tired now, maybe we need to move those other doctor appointments so we won't have two in one day, is that too much for you, for one day .. is that why you were sighing .. what's wrong, are you sure you're alright".
Hopefully that kinda gives a little bit of a snapshot of what goes on when sister is in the ring directing things.
So in mother in law's defense.. I do get it, why she wouldn't be chomping at the bit to go to her daughter's home.
BUT ....
The only experience she has with her daughter, in the last years as mother in law has aged and been unable to go anywhere much, has been the daughter coming here, periodically, for periods of about 3 weeks at a stretch. When her daughter comes here, she moves heaven and earth for her mother and then some, and doesn't sit down, doesn't stop .. the WHOLE ENTIRE TIME.
Is there a possibility maybe (as I said to mother in law, when she expressed that isn't happening - talking to me - her going to her daughters .. ever) .. could it be possible that maybe if you would go to where she lives .. she'd be more busy managing her own life in that setting than your's and she would get out of your backside .. and not be as hyper-drive-vigilant as you experience in her, when she's here, could that be possible.
The daughter is retired, lives several states away. Does come here, generally, every few months .. and stays for a period of about 3 weeks at a stretch. I wish I could make a list of everything the daughter did when here this last time, but it would take up the whole character allotment:
Part of what is lacking here is not JUST the lack of finances, but the intransigence and denial. No one talks about what the choices are, and how they are constrained by lack of money.
There is lots of "hoping" and "wishing" but very little "thinking" and "research" that are the bedrock of good decision making.
Fact on the ground
1. MIL has no money
2. MIL needs the dog's needs to be met.
3. MIL needs help with groundskeeping, housekeeping, food prep and laundry.
4. MIL's house is in bad repair
5. MIL has multiple medical issues.
6. MIL proclaims that she is done living and wants to go to the cloud in the sky; doesn't want to be kept alive by machines with no one able to make the decision to disconnect.
1. Someone needs to be her health care proxy. Best for it to be someone close by, ie DH
2. Someone needs to take MIL to lawywer to have legal forms updated. IE, DH
3. Someone needs to have hard conversation with MIL about what medical interventions she wants. And to point out to her that if she WANTS them, she needs to be willing to do whatever it takes to get her there.
4. Get dog on a regular grooming schedule. Get special food on a regular pick up schedule.
You need to stay TOUGH. Really, really tough. One crack in the armor and you will back in the driver's seat, hauling MIL hither and yon.
It's not like MIL doesn't HAVE her "team" (laughing inserted here). They just aren't functioning as one. And she doesn't have to capability to get them to.
Also, she's too stuck up to use either public transport or Ubers, so while I do feel kind of sorry for her, she's created this all on her own and now she's suffering the consequences. She's not organized enough to plan an eye dr visit along with a PCP visit on the same THURSDAY and man up enough to use your time efficiently.
Did it ever occur to you that she could easily be falling more than she reports? Mother does. Unless there is visible bruising, she will not "report" a fall. Just a thought. I mean, she does her own laundry, after a fashion, right? That must be beyond difficult for her.
SO sad that the carefully crafted team has shrunk to one good old standby. You. You're starting to sound like you might waver, and you just cannot do that for things like poochy runs and jello runs and, well, most anything but an emergency.
I gotta go elevate this foot. But, before I exit, I want to say that you are doing such a good job. Your heart is still "wanting" to make things better for her, but by forcing her to take ownership of her choices, she will hopefully eventually, maybe make some changes and avail herself of the many "helpers" in her community--that are not YOU.
As far as the will, etc. I finally got my MIL to make one when I told her that she would have total strangers going through her stuff and determining what went where and her desire for her 3 kids to inherit may wel wind up being that there wouldn't be 2 cents left after the lawyers got done. She was appalled "They'll go through my UNDERWEAR" Yes ma'am, indeed they will (therapuetic fib, I know) --but within 2 weeks she had a will and whatever else she needs...should she ever die. I am pretty sure she'll outlive her 2 oldest sons (start having a family at 17 and that can happen).
Still--it took that kind of "scare tactic" to make her sit up and notice. Plus the fact I do not stand to inherit once cent and I don't care who goes through her underwear.
So who is the more dysfunctional here, this family that keeps sticking their head in the sand and wishing and hoping ............ or me .............. for not blowing my stack and telling every last one of em just how crazy they all are, and that I'M OUT ......... DO YOU HEAR ME ... O-U-T, OUT!
Yes,, indeed ......... INDEED ............. the son and the daughter both need to jump on this .. especially now that she herself has brought it up in conversation with me, ... it needs to be something they both are getting on, and talking about, between the two of them .. and with her, and as to finding a suitable legal counsel and so forth.
Are either of them (and yes I told both of them) ... are they?
What do ya'll think?
A big fat resounding No.
And it won't happen either. She may .. she may bring it up again, when I'm there to visit with her, .. and I will circle it back to her kids .. "you need to really be talking to both of your kids about this .. this is more their area than mine". And keep circling back to that.
See, .. see how this would work normally is that, .. she's mentioned this to me, I mention it to them, .. and nothing happens .. I harp .. I nag .. I remind .. I prompt .. and nothing happens. I grow more and more frustrated .. and nothing happens even still.
This time, it has been mentioned to both parties (DH and his sister) .. and the prompt included what it is my thoughts are on the topic .. as to consulting some legal counsel and talking with her about going forward with what's needed. I won't continue to harp on DH and his sister. They've been told, that should be enough.
But BY GOD the PJ's are ironed aren't they?
And the dog is groomed.
And the driveway doesn't have a speck of dirt anywhere on it.
I will go on my Thursday and do my part, to be a part of her life and help where I can .. but continue to try to rid myself of the frustrations that come with being in any of it. It's tough, really tough.
Midkid is right. She doesn't possess the ability at this point in her state of being, to organize any sense of what things should look like, two doc appts in one day, to utilize time effectively.
But by golly she's "happy" ... and in the end, .. that's what matters. Just ask her offspring .. they'll tell ya.
The eye doc appt., I haven't a clue what it is for .. the Histioplasmosis (sp?), a vision check, I don't know. Didn't ask. Since I won't be stepping in to manage that .. and be a part of it, it's really not anything I need to know.
And yes, apparently there was a dental appt., that was missed, .. maybe she didn't feel up to it, maybe transportation was an issue, not sure. She apparently has a broken tooth in the back that needs to be addressed (so I hear from SIL).
Her stamina is such that having 2 doc appts in one day would likely be more than she could withstand.
SIL let me know that she has that dental appt on the radar for when she's here .. as well as working out the eye appt., to reschedule so she can attend to it when she's here.
Good .. as far as I'm concerned, .. my going with her, and getting the straight skinny on what the goings on are .. as reported by MD .. might as well go in one ear and out the other. Been there/done that, and partly why I ended up where I was with it all ... waste of my time .. to haul her hither and yon and hear if you will do x, y and z, then we will see if that improves a, b and c, and if it doesn't we might try d, e and f. But she doesn't address the x, y and z ... and follow through and do it .. and running back to the doc as the symptoms continue and she's advised the same thing .. over and over, waste of my time.
Thus the reason I said, she needs to be living with her daughter ... her daughter, .. when she's here, takes her to all these appts., let her be the one to hear what the docs recommend, but more importantly be in attendance, .. to see to the x, y and z recommended. She's her daughter,, not me.
Talking with my own dad tonight (lives local .. about 45 minutes away). We had plans, earlier in the week, to meet tomorrow for Father's Day .. lunch out, he and his wife (my stepmom).
Plans cancelled.
He isn't up to it.
My dad and his wife, fiercely private and also fiercely independent ...
I'm aware he has been fighting an infection, under side of his foot .. for almost 2 years. No he isn't diabetic, .. he is 80 yo .. and I guess .. foot injuries .. and MRSA .. mostly that latter fact as an issue, can be a real problem. I know that there have been times it's been close to healing, only to re-open, the wound.
Anywho .. I'm aware that has been an ongoing issue now for the better part of almost 2 years .. the fight to rid himself of the MRSA .. off and on, it goes away but comes back .. at times .. and the wound also, same.
Finally, about a month ago, it had finally closed and the all-clear given on the MRSA. He was looking .. somewhat enthusiastically to now be able to address some spine procedures that need to occur, but have been put off because of "active" MRSA infection.
Finally given the all-clear about two weeks ago. Ahh, but .. he began to develop a sore spot on the under side of his toe .. this .. he thought, a result of the orthotic rx'd .. for his shoe .. to keep the weight bearing off of that prior wound site.
Turned out, yes indeed, there were two blood blisters that had formed, and .. damned if he doesn't have MRSA in it again. And so .. here we go again ..and the spine issues, on hold .. AGAIN.
I ask, .. as I always do, .. repeatedly .. time and time again ... and it's always declined. What can I do to help, I will bring meals .. I will haul you to doc appts., .. to give stepmom a break .. I will just come visit .. what is I can do to help? It's always, always ............ did I say ALWAYS declined.
Fiercely independent.
They "do" have the means to hire out that which they can't do themselves, and they do precisely that.
My dad mentioned that stepmom .. behind them having had a tree taken down in their yard, and a whole lot of mulch leftover .. has been out there with the wheelbarrow .. hauling mulch to spread in flower beds, much to his chagrin and worry about her. He has offered, the yard man was willing, to bag it all and haul it away .. no no .. no .. no she wants to do it herself, .. wants the exercise.
Now were they bestowed with SIL as a daughter, she'd be on the horn with any number of neighbors and/or whatever she can dig up from afar, .. to get someone on this and stop at once, this wheelbarrowing of mulch.
It's not SIL they were bestowed with as a daughter, it's me. Did I offer to go over and haul wheelbarrows of mulch around to flower beds. Nope. And not going to. Did I offer to pay the yard man to do so for them, yes .. and it was, as is everything else I ever offer .. declined. No no, she wants to do it, wants the exercise .. and she keeps saying she's pacing herself, .. I can't get out there to see if she is indeed pacing herself, and I wish she'd knock it off and let the yard guy take care of it, but that's like trying to herd cats .. not gonna happen, she's gonna do what she wants.
I left it alone. Not gunna hound them .. as to the dangers .. and perils ..and what if you get hurt .. and you don't need to be doing that, . now let me get all up in this and solve it for you ..
Nope.
THAT .............. is the difference, in my approach .. yet I deal with .. far too frequently ..a SIL with an approach that is quite opposite mine.
But I think the SIL is getting my drift .. slowly .. ever so slowly .. but I think she may get it eventually, the school of thought I operate from, doesn't really fit with her's.
and then this: " Did I offer to go over and haul wheelbarrows of mulch around to flower beds. Nope. And not going to. Did I offer to pay the yard man to do so for them, yes .. and it was, as is everything else I ever offer .. declined. No no, she wants to do it, wants the exercise ..."
But if stepmom hurts herself and isn't able to do these things, they might be looking to YOU to take care of this sort of thing. Why did you offer to pay, if they have means?
These elders want to do it all themselves, but when it comes to the point that they must hire someone, many prefer that family (usually the children) do it, even if they have the means to hire others.
So even though you're off the hook now, doesn't mean they won't expect you to hop-to in the future. And what about your mother? Isn't she a serial bride? What happens when the latest husband dies/leaves? Is she financially secure, or will you be expected to hop-to?
I'm just concerned, because you seem to be a very generous person, and it's not only in-laws who could take advantage of that...
"Well, there is no real need for this. My grandchildren all know that Reba gets xyz, Kristin gets abc, etc."
I said, "Yeah, they may know that, but your passing will bring out the knives and there WILL be fighting, especially if nothing is in writing."
She then told me she plans to give away her jewelry to her grandchildren while she is still living so she can see them enjoy it. She has not given away anything yet and she has enough health issues that she probably won't live another year.
So we made a short list and then she became very paranoid about any of the grandchildren seeing it and she hid it. Now she no longer remembers where! So it is as if we never made one.
Same with my mother. I think it was foolish that she up and sold her condo here (yes, serial bride) .. to move to where her latest husband's 5 kids live (grown kids). They aren't going to look after her in the event their dad is long gone, and she now old and infirm.
Firmly aware that it will fall to me. Also in part, .... why there was pushback on my part, with all things MIL and need. My day is coming, .... and no, I don't expect that DH or SIL will be in the fray that I can direct them as to much of any help with any of it. And, have said as much to both DH and to SIL. My day is coming .. I have to have something left of a compassionate bone in my body to be able to deal with my own parents.
And yes .. Xena ..............
The other day when I was with MIL, she needed that I run by the bank for her to deposit a payment sent to her from her pet insurance, as reimbursement for pet medical expense.
First problem was locating it .. "well it was right here, I sat it here earlier because I didn't want to forget to have you do that, now where did it go?". Sorting thru the various paper work in front of her at her perch there at the kitchen table, ..
Finally located it. Now she has to get the pen and endorse the check and remarking on how bad her handwriting is these days and how she has to literally stop and think about it, as to the alphabet and what letters and so forth, and yes questions by me, "are you still able to pay your own bills, do you need SIL to maybe begin doing that for you, if you struggle so to write".
Finally get the deposit slip and check .. and I'm on my way now, it's afternoon, to go pick up poochy and bring poochy back to her, .. and then when I leave I will stop by the bank for her on my way home, to deposit the above check.
So off I go to retrieve poochy ..
When I got in my car, I did as I always do, .. stuck the check/deposit slip up under the visor above me, so that it's a reminder to me, and I won't forget to make that stop once I dispense with poochy biz.
I get back to her house, with poochy and she says, "now what was the amount of that check that I gave you so that I can write it in my checkbook here?".
I begin sorting thru the paperwork in front of her, "well the stub that was torn off of it, should be here, I didn't throw it away, what does the stub say?". Sorting thru, .. the stub nowhere to be found. I don't know what she did with it, in the 15 mins, it had taken me to go get poochy and bring him back to her. But it was gone.
Out to my car, I had to go now, to go look at the check, to report to her what the amount was ..
Now she had that check .. and had made it a point to put it in front of her (supposedly) so as to not forget to give it to me ... somewhere in all of that, one would think she'd of noted the amount and entered it into the checkbook .. not to mention having misplaced it ...
As to going over to shovel/wheelbarrow mulching around to flower beds .. I don't do yardwork ... never have ...
Won't do it for MIL, and not for my dad.
And yes, if she gets hurt doing that, and she could .. then ... will that put the sites on me, as to the care of both on that end, .. it possibly could. But these are two fiercely private .. that's first and foremost .. private folks .. but beyond that fiercely independent folks.
They hire out what they aren't able to do/don't want to do.
Recently .. they had some kind of leak in the wall, . plumbing issue of some sort, .. and so the closet had to be emptied .. sounds like she has clothes from the 60's .. and all a size or 10 smaller than she is now .. but she's gonna get back to that size by darnit .. (I don't know where she thinks she will wear these clothes, from the 60's .. now that she finally achieves that smaller size, but oh well, she readily admits what a packrat she is).
Dad voicing that the clothes . once emptied from that closet .. were EVERYWHERE in stacks .. and that she was going to have to finally . sort thru it all, and maybe dispense with some things.
Again, I offered to come help with that ... she IS afterall, pretty occupied taking care of and looking after my dad and his ailments. Again, as is always the case .. offer declined. Her own daughter .. also .. pushing that agenda .. she too, .. refuted in her offers to help.
Fiercely private.
At this point, .. there seems to be some concern on their parts .. (I offered to go pick up a take out and go there, since dad is under the weather with this latest MRSA issue) .. we'd originally planned to meet for lunch today but that's dashed/cancelled. I offered to go pick up a takeout somewhere and come visit and bring some food.
That was declined. Seems to be some concern on their parts, .. MRSA an issue .. and them fully aware how much I deal with twin babies .. and so the very thought that a germ could jump on me, and be carried back to babies .. they really .. warranted or not .. want me away from there .. and nowhere near that risk. Warranted? I don't know.
I think more than anything, at least with him, at present .. this latest MRSA issue to crop up .. yet again, after having fought it for almost 2 years and beat it .. it has knocked him back, psychologically speaking. Not one to get down in the dumps .. but this has knocked him back .. several pegs. He's not one to sit idle . and a foot wound .. has really sidelined him. Hard for him.
His wife has 3 sisters that all live relatively close .. and they .. one or the other .. throughout all of this .. have been some help to her .. some ... she won't let people help her really .. wants to do it all herself. Bringing a meal, .. bringing medical stuff .. like rubber gloves and peroxide and antibiotic ointment, etc etc.
So go over there and rummage around to find the wheelbarrow that's in use .. and go to digging it up and spreading it all around .. even though I offered to fund it (yes, they do have the means to pay for it, and yard man offered, and much to my dad's chagrin .. she won't let the yard man deal with it, wants the exercise) .. nope, that declined also.
It's an odd situation in that, . my mom and dad divorced when I was about .. oh I don't know .. maybe 5 or 6 years old. My dad remarried, .. when I was 8 or 9. The wife he has to this day. She had a daughter of her own, from a prior marriage. Lived with my dad for a while, and in those days .. I don't think step families acclimated as some do these days. I don't think as much was known .. and studied about .. as to how divorce and blending families impacts the children of such settings. Seems today, more is known and it's treated a little differently than in those days.
My brother and I actually didn't meet her until we went to the wedding. That's the truth.
We suddenly had a stepmom .. and a stepsister we'd never met before, and moved into a new house on the other side of town .. a house the two had bought.
My dad traveled a lot in those days which left me and my brother in the line of fire, as to the new stepmom and her care and direction. There was much favoritism .. her daughter on the receiving end of that .. and we were .. truly .. treated like the red-headed stepchild .. both of us.
Wasn't long .. and we both . as kids . petitioned to go live with my mom and her husband .. and so that move was made. I was probably 12 when we moved to live w/my mom and her husband.
From there forward, . visits to dad's and his wife's were the proverbial every-other-weekend ... shared custody sorta thing seen in divorces. A "bond" not really there ... a difficult one.
Through the years .. it was pretty apparent that their lives revolved .. in large measure .. around her daughter and what she was doing .. sports/school ... etc ... and going forward, thru the years as we all grew up and had kids of our own .. them an interest in her daughter and her kids and the goings on there, .. with those g'kids .. not so much over here.
It is what it is. I don't beat him over the head with it all, he has his regrets that have been mentioned from time to time .. wishes he'd of done things differently. Can't change it now, and no need to go clobber an old man at this point, .. I'm well past grown as are my kids who also really have no relationship to speak of .. with he or his wife ..even though we all live within 45 mins of each other.
It's not a relationship where I would be in any position to take the bull by the horns and go over and run roughshod over what they wish as to their daily existence.
Not that I would do that anyway .. it's not in my nature.
#1.) Someone suggested that Dorker’s MIL might be falling more frequently than she reports. YES. Granted, I do not have a spy-cam in MIL’s home. But let’s put the probability at 99.9%.
#2) Dorker’s dad and step-mom jump on every excuse to cancel or deflect a visit from Dorker because they are trying to hide how out-of-control their home life is. My mom & her hubby pulled the same sh*t on me, chapter and verse. And I, too, was “only” 45 minutes away. When you are still in your working/productive years (as Dorker is and I was) it might as well be 4.5 hours.
To both of these observations: No judgment. None whatsoever. Just calling them like I see them.
We sane, healthy “kids” offer targeted help and give good advice to our needy elders. And it is dismissed out-of-hand by these (legally) competent adults.
So we “kids” wait for the game-changer phone call.
It’s bullsh*t. It’s stressful. And it’s unfair.
That's why I love Guestshopadmin's advice to do this research for when your parents start expecting YOU to do what you probably have told them that you (at one time, until you started enforcing boundaries) did for MIL.
As difficult as it's been for you to set and enforce boundaries regarding MIL, isn't it going to be that much more difficult to enforce boundaries with your own parents?
Step-mom dies or becomes disabled herself, stepfather dies or your mother becomes disabled, and won't it all suddenly fall into your lap? (I'm assuming stepdad might not stay in the picture long if your mother needs a lot of help.) Might help to start thinking about boundaries now...
Educate yourself about the ins and outs of Medicaid, private pay until Medicaid, etc. Take tours of various facilities. Keep a binder of all the possibilities.
When my mom "all of a sudden" needed assisted living, we blindly signed her up to live at the same AL where our closest cousin had several of her husband's relatives. It was a nice place. It just wasn't what mom needed; the ethos was all wrong.
I guess that I'm lucky that I HAVE to work for a living; I didn't have the ability (and frankly, no desire) to become my mom's hand's on caregiver. We tried in-home care and it didn't work.
Dorker, if you mentioned the Living Will and POA issue to SIL and DH once, that's all you can do. The ball is in their and MIL's court. Don't wring your hands over it. Let MIL wring HER hands over it; SHE's the one who is going to be in a persistent vegetative state, not you.
As for my mom ... (the serial bride) .... she "WAS" a resident here in the state of FL, and I have done a little looking into it all, as to the state of FL. I have no idea what SC info would be, where she moved to. Does my mom wish to continue living in the state of SC in the event of her latest husband's demise ... ??.... I don't know. I doubt it. She'd probably want to return to FL, to be nearer her 3 offspring she left behind here in the state. She does not have the resources to do the things she might wish. Is it possible, staring down the barrel of the same issues SIL is facing with her mom ... her mom ..may or may not ever go to IL ..and if she does go .. may eventually become a Medicaid recipient of that state, for housing in a facility. Will that even be possible when no state residency is established there? Will that be an issue with my mom, who might wish to return to FL to be nearer her offspring that all live here, yet she isn't a state of FL any longer? Good questions, .. questions I have no answers for.
I did talk to my mom, when she decided she was selling her condo here, and moving to SC. "Mom .. what will happen to you when "T" dies .. if he dies, you're up there with nothing but his family ... you're family is all here, I don't think that's wise, .. you aren't getting any younger yourself, what happens when you get more aged/needy".
Answer given: "We don't any of us know when our number comes up, for that matter I could go before "T" does .. and so staying here, ... where I don't want to be ... isn't something I want to do". That and more dialogue with her, .. on what her thoughts are ... as she made this move .. and my admonishment that I didn't think it was smart to do this.
Fortunately, for her, for right now, she has a spouse ... and so they .. if they have any health issues, lean on one another. She doesn't, nothing serious. She's pretty spry .. so far. She thrives on taking care of a "man". And she has one now. And so she's thriving. What will happen if he passes before she does? I really don't know. Will he kick her to the curb, should she become someone more frail and needy and unable to "dote on him"? I don't think so .. he seems, unlike her previous husband, someone who genuinely cares for her and would do his best for her. That, we all agree on, her offspring.
My dad .. also .. at present .. has a spouse .. and so they too, lean on one another. She had a bad back .. a few years back .. and was pretty much sidelined with it, for several months, and my dad took care of her, and did it all (much to the displeasure of stepmom .. who doesn't take it well, having anyone dote on her).
Thus far, both of my parents still have their respective spouses and aren't alone, as MIL is.
Both of my parents have had a lot to say (my mom more than my dad, .. dad who keeps his opinions to himself, for the most part, unless solicited for same). They've had a few things to say about what they've seen go on with MIL and all it takes to prop her situation up.
Would I be in the road hauling my mom, or my dad for that matter, to doctors .. yes I would, they are my parents. There is a difference, in my view .. MIL is not my mother. Yes both of my parents have seen all that I've gone through with it all, and have voiced their concern/displeasure with it all ... but they've seen me do it ... and they are both aware that I've now put some firm boundaries in place, and they cheer me on for doing so. But would there be expectation on their parts, that I'd do the same for them, especially since they've darn sure seen me do it for MIL? Yes, they likely would. Easy for them to say at this point, what they have to say about the situation they've watched in MIL .. they both have respective spouses to lean on. They may not always have that.
I would do the very best that I can, and if that means hauling either of them to doctor appts .. and so forth, yes I will do so, they are MY parents. The fact that MIL chooses to continue to live in a place where she has little support and chooses not to avail herself of the support that is there at her disposal (city transit, private for hire transport) is not on me to then facilitate. I did do so for a long time, but not any longer. I would help either one of my parents, to the degree I am able to do so, but there would also be much more of a "reality-based" approach .. and I think .. coming from my family of origin .. and the way they do things .. and operate ... that wouldn't be seen with the same intransigence as we see with MIL.
If it were my mother, and I told her, "well gee mom looks like you have 3 doc appts this week, .. I think I can help you with two of them .. you may need to get a g'friend .. or maybe we'll just get you lined up with city transit for that 3rd one", ........... she wouldn't be so obstinate and stuck up as to refuse same.
In fact, let's remember back to a time a few years back, my mom living here, her world having crumbled out from under her .. a yacht as her living arrangement and a dead spouse that was the captain of said yacht. Until she could sell that yacht .. she was living with me, here. Yes, .. she was allowed to live here, there was no expectation of care on here behalf . she able bodied and fine, just needed a roof over her head.
At that time, .. she witnessed a dilemma ongoing .. I had to work, .. DH had to work, MIL had a doc appt., who/what to do? Mom witnessing this, .. offered to help ... "Hey guys, if your mom will let me, I'll go get her, it's not a problem, I'd be glad to help" (though she really doesn't care much for MIL as a person). She was kind enough to offer to step in and help. This, presented to MIL .. and refused. MIL's excuse: "Well you know, I mean I know your mom from having seen her at bday parties and family functions but I don't REALLY know her .. I'm not all that comfortable with her, and you know how unstable I am when I walk, I really have to hold onto someone to be able to get around, .. and I don't feel comfortable doing that with your mom, I just don't know her that well". Offer refused.
Mom having been told this, .. response of "Well ya don't go kicking a gift horse in the damn mouth .. it's not like I'm some hoity toity that she can't take my arm to hold onto to steady herself, but whatever .. figure it out on your own", was her response about the whole thing.
Therein, example of where mom thought her approach, offering to step in where needed, a completely viable option (I agree) .. one where she, someone who would suggest such a thing .. wouldn't be oppositional herself to such a setting were she the one in need.
I don't know,... I think we come from, myself and DH .. completely different ............ couldn't be more different ..... as to our families of origin.
Just in talking to stepmom yesterday as she weathers more caring for my dad, and yes, refusing my help ... (her sisters help, to the extent she'll let them). Her asking me how MIL is doing .. and my sharing briefly .. (she knows things have gotten strained, and she doesn't understand for the life of her why MIL is so *selfish* .. her words ... that she continues to refuse to go live with her daughter and let her daughter help her), .. sharing just a it of info with stepmom on it all, .. her words: "Ya know Dorker, she is just being out and out selfish .. the fact that her daughter is retired, and has offered to help her, .. but she has to come to where her daughter is for that help and for her to continue to refuse to do so, what is she thinking ... you and DH can't prop it all up .. all the time, that is just unfair ... she can't take care of her house, her pet .. or herself .. but she refuses to go where her daughter can help her, .. she's .. quite frankly .. she's being selfish".
I concur.
These are the people on my side of the family and the way they think ..
Then you have on DH's side of the family .. their mindset ... "they want their mom *happy*, is she *happy* .. well then it's all good". All the minutia of how she takes care of herself, or doesn't, and the perils that befall it all, all along the way, inconsequential.
Difference in approaches.
I don't think any of this even came to light through all our years of being married and raising kids and contemplation of "gee what will we do when our folks get old and need help". First and foremost, we were busy working and raising our kids ourselves .. but beyond that .. at least as far as MIL it was always thought .. in fact, .. it was said, that SIL would be, at some point, departing the great white north and all that entails, with shoveling snow .. and so forth .. for parts south of there, .. buy a home here. I guess, at least with respect to DH's aging parents, that was the approach talked about, for forever.
Hasn't panned out that way.
As far as the approach and any dialogue with regard to my parents .. and what will become of the situation .. DH and I both have said .. "we can only take it as it comes, and do the best we can", which leaves things wide open .. for interpretation of the subjective nature of "do the best we can", .. whose "best" .. and who decides.
Yesterday being Father's Day. Of course we'd originally planned to meet with my dad, .. and have lunch, plans there fell through. No plans made in place of the above, just left things at loose ends.
I'm the planner remember. But this wasn't Mother's Day this was Father's Day and so I didn't hop in it all with a mindset of "now let me get the wheels turning here, and plan out the day for everybody". I figured, I'm not the dad here .. I'll just let it be, if DH wants to do something to mark the day let him come up with it, .. and leave it be, and that's what I did.
Was a very quiet day ... very down .. not active day. Some mention along the way about getting with DD and her crew (YD was out of town at her b'friend's .. and OD was busy doing whatever OD does with her days off). Brief mention of getting with DD and crew, but for varying reasons that wasn't panning out .. and so it was just an all quiet low-key kinda day. DH spent some time working on his truck .. and some yard work .. and doing just what he wants or doesn't want.
Then it got to be approaching dinner time, .. I asked if there's any specific takeout he wants .. I'll go get it. No .. couldn't think of anything that struck his fancy.
He mentioned going to that little seafood dive that we all love so much, that he'd really like to go there, but then .. the dread of .... it's also his mother's favorite place to go (in fact, about the only place she'll actually .. if she's able to do so .. and she isn't always .. get ready and actually go, but even that is waning, her ability to do that). So he mentioned that favorite little seafood dump where we like to go ... incidentally the very place that on Mother's Day .. we went and got a takeout of boiled shrimp and brought it to MIL's to enjoy .. with her, .. same place.
DH asked, with a bit of trepidation to his tone .... obviously not specifically what he wanted ... he asked, "should we just do what we did on Mother's Day .. go get a pile of boiled shrimp and take it to mom's .... I feel bad .. it's Father's Day and we haven't included her in anything at all".
I responded, "it's Father's Day .. not Mother's Day .. what DO YOU WANT .. is that what you want to do, .. to make sure your mom is included, .. it doesn't matter to me, this isn't my bday or Mother's Day .. this is Father's Day it's about what you want to do".
He said: "No, not really .. I don't want boiled shrimp .. I want maybe some fried fish .. and that's not good as takeout, gets all soggy ... I don't know".
As we sat, clock ticking time wasting ... and no decision.
He again mentioned what to do .. what to do ...???..... wanted, obviously, to go to that little seafood dump/dive that we all so like/enjoy. But what to do about his mom ...???...what to do ........... oy vey!!!!!!!!!!
To go to that specific restaurant (and bear in mind, it's one of the only places, she'll actually get dressed and go .. if she's able to do so, she also loves that place so much) one has to drive right past the street that you turn on to go to her house, to get to this restaurant.
If you had any idea .. how many times we've gone to this restaurant .. probably hundreds .. and almost every time ... we have included her .. because we know she loves it, because we know she's a shut in and has no other resource to get there, .. and socialize .. and eat out, ... it's just something we've almost always done .. if going to that specific seafood joint ... try to include her, .. through the years. Almost always .. it's been a rare occasion that just he and I would go, and just leave her completely out .. we've done it, but I bet I can count on one hand the number of times we've done so, we always take her into consideration. Trying always, through the years, to be thoughtful and conscientious about her being a lonely frail, shut in.
But as we sit and ponder and the clock is ticking away closer and closer to dinner time, no decision, nobody pulling the trigger. It was almost like, for he and I both, ... neither of us wanted the bother of having to consider her in all of the above equation.
A dilemma.
If we call her to ask .. 1 of two things will happen:
A) she'll agree to go, .. is able to do so .. and feeling up to it .. which is always questionable with her .......... but that will now mean we have to wait ... on Father's Day when .. wait long enough, you'll now have to sit there and wait for a table, it gets crowded. Call her and put this on her radar .. and her agreeable/able to get up and get ready .. now you'll wait at least an hour or so before she can even be dressed and ready .. if not more .. and you're now upon the dinner hour .. and a wait at the restaurant, not something either of us really cared to do, .. find ourselves sitting and waiting for any duration. This place is just a little dive of a seafood shack and has no bar per se, to go have a few drinks and pass the time away enjoying some libations. It's just a little dump but the food there is so good, so fresh. So, .. we ponder .. gee .. call her .. and her agreeable/able to manage to do this, .. well now we're gonna be waiting for her to get ready .. she can't just change gears and get of the pj's she wears daily nowdays .. and get dressed on a dime, and get her face on .. it takes her an hour or more to do so .. and so then we wait for her to get ready, when we can be there in 30 mins ourselves and sit down and eat and be back home, which is really what both of us wanted .. just low-key, low maintenance. Go get her, .. wait for her to amble so slowly to the car, then so slowly into the restaurant .. we just both wanted low-key ...
OR
B) Her not up to it, but her suggesting, "Well I so loved it on Mother's Day when you guys came with all that boiled shrimp from that place, .. if you guys wanna do that, .. that'd be great .. if you want to just pick up some boiled shrimp and come this way.
The above were the two scenarios one might bump into in trying to make sure she isn't left unaccounted for to mark this date (and yes, we realize, this is Father's Day .. she isn't a Father .. we both realize that .. but the only Father in her world at this point, is her son, father of his own kids and g'kids .. but .. just trying to weigh out and be conscientious .. of marking occasions/dates/holidays .. and not leave her out in the cold .. something we've always strived to do ........
Weighing it out, neither of us making any move to make any decision .. just indecision ongoing .. and stall .. and just no action to make any forward progress.
It was a dilemma.
It has begun to bother me through the last few years that I've seen her grow more and more needy and frail and unable to manage .. and we've had to always .. every holiday that rolls around .. be that someone's bday .. her bday ... be that xmas, t'giving .. Easter, 4th of July you name it, .. times when people gather, families .. etc .. that we've always had to make provision for how best to include her.
At one time,.. she was able to get in her car and drive over here, if we are doing something and join in. It got to the point that was too much for her to manage .. and so one of us would go get her and bring her here if we were gathering here .. but even that has gotten to be too much for her, .. so for a long while I'd move the party to her house .. and all gather there, me hauling everything but the kitchen sink to prepare it all there, in the interest of including her.
If we were going out to a restaurant to mark whatever the occasion happened to be, .. then we'd try to include her by going to get her, this has been the case for eons .. as to how it's gone, and it had begun to bother me thru the last few years as her need and frailty continues to worsen .. that we always .. a holiday/occasion can't come that we don't have to somehow figure how to make her a part of it all.
For a long while it was done .. including her, from a standpoint of pure .. wanting to include her, the poor shut in .. and poor poor lonely MIL. It truly was. But then . it got to be .. as her frailty has increased .. and her stubborn refusal to do anything else .. that would accommodate her neediness .. it's gotten to be more of a PITA .. to always have to .. at every corner of every occasion . take her into consideration as to how best to include her.
I suggested yesterday as we both couldn't seem to make up our minds .. obvious we both wanted to go to the seafood dive .. but how to do that and not include MIL . which would make us both feel like heels .. if not include her and take her, then at least go get stuff and bring it to her house, so we don't feel like complete chits driving right past her street to get there. But neither of us really wanting to do that.
I suggested, "maybe we just change course entirely here . maybe we just go up the road here and grab a pizza .. and be done with it .. or I can run out and go grab some chinese food .. or .. we can just go get some chicken wings at the corner bar .. and that then negates any feeling bad about going to that seafood dive and not making any provision for your mom, wanna do that?".
No answer, .. just .. intransigence .. inertia .. not decision, no action.
In the end, DH appeared, ready to go, dressed, "C'mon let's go". Going to the seafood dive. I asked, "Did you call your mom, are we going to get her, to take her with us". Nope .. just gonna go .. just not bother with it .. feel bad but nope .. just .. let's just us go .. I feel guilty driving right past her street .. and not making any provision whatsoever to include her, but I just dont' wanna wait for her to take forever to get dressed which will then mean we have to wait for a table when we get there, and I'm not in the mood for boiled shrimp for dinner, that's not what I want, and she'd want us to bring that to her .. so no .. just not even gonna mention any of it to her, let's go.
So that's what we did.
Now do you see, .............. something that should be so simple .... a little seafood dump place that we so enjoy .. but it happens to be just up the road from where she lives .. and one has to pass right by her street to get there .. and we KNOW, WE KNOW, WE KNOW .. that she too absolutely loves that place, .. and WE KNOW WE KNOW WE KNOW . that we've ALWAYS done our level best, thru the years, if going there .. to that specific spot .. to include her . we've always done that. Not so much if we're going for bque out, or a pizza or whatever .. that doesn't really float her boat and so no need to go get her .. but this place .. oh yes .. oh absolutely.
I was actually rather proud of us, (me). As we passed by, on the way, the street we'd turn down to go get her, if she were to be picked up, DH remarked again, "I feel bad going without including her, she so loves the food there, .. and she's just a damn shut in .. I feel bad".
I said to him, "DH your dad died in 2003 and since that time, we have done everything we can to make her a part of our world for every corner of every holiday, bday whatever .. we always have .. we've always done our level best ... all the way to hauling all the chit out there to her house, .. since it's too hard for her to get and go .. THIS is precisely why it would be good if she'd go to your sister's for a while ... at least a damn holiday might come up that we don't have to take her into consideration as to how best to include her in the goings on .. it's not fair to us that we can't just go out and have a simple damn dinner, .. and not have the weight on our shoulders that we are just dismissing and ignoring her .. this isn't Mother's Day .. we did mark that occasion and account for her, this is Father's Day . not Mother's Day . not her bday .. she isn't a father".
DH said in response: "Well my bday is later this week, hopefully whatever we're doing we can include her in that".
Me: "Nope .. not unless she wants to come over to our house (I doubt she'll do that, if she does, fine c'mon .. but I doubt she will) ..... I am cooking you a bday dinner, and cake and having the kids over, .. it's already in the works .. and no, I can't haul all that I'm fixing over to her house to fix it there. I'm cooking one of your favorites, .. country fried steak and mashed potatoes and gravy .. and I'm not gonna haul all that I need to put all that together, all of it over to your mom's house, not doing it .. if someone wants to go get her and her come over and join, she's welcome .. or if you'd like to make her a plate of leftovers and after dinner, run out and sit with her, while she enjoys some of your bday dinner .. and your company, have at it. That was met with a turned up nose, as in .. I'll be done for the day .. after working all day then coming in to a nice dinner and bday cake, and my family I'm not gonna want to hop in the truck and head out that way. Fine .. your mom .. you do what you want.
I have to say .. disengaging .. as I've worked to do .. it wasn't easy yesterday there was a twinge of .. "oh I do feel bad for her, why didn't we plan a little better here .. and let her know well in advance what our plans are, and then go pick her up, so we weren't pushing up against the dinner hour and then stressing us out .. when all we want to do is enjoy a nice low key meal out .. did make me a feel a little bad .. but so be it, her choice to remain in her home, a virtual shut in .......... that doesn't then mean that we have to always up end our own world and priorities to accommodate that fact.
Progress.
And remember last year, for DH's 60th bday and the big shindig we had here, and her invited .. and she wouldn't come, not able to do it. So be it. She will be invited again, and if she wants to come, .. one of us will go get her .. but I doubt she'll do so. Her choice. Doesn't then mean I will change course of what it is I'm fixing for dinner because it's too cumbersome to fix country fried steak and haul all the makings out there .. no that's what I want to fix .. and that .. I have everything here that I need to do it .. and so I'll do it here. Doesn't mean that I now figure a way to haul it all out there, to make sure she's a part of everything .. doesn't mean that we now change course, and never-mind .. we'll just go out somewhere, that way she can be a part of it all . nope.
Progress, ever so slow, but progress. I'll take it.
All that angst about a simple dinner out yesterday, when there is apparently no angst about the stuff that matters (plans for MIL's future, POA, health care proxy, living will, etc.).
I've said it, .. to the parties involved. Now outta my hands.
Not harping on it, I don't do that any longer. It only causes angst then that comes at me in the form of blowback. "We'll get to it Dorker, GAWD you're like a broken damn record repeating the same thing .. you told me already!".
Nope. Not going there.
Oh and FWIW .. hadn't talked to her at all yesterday .. not sure why she didn't call and wish DH a Happy Father's Day but whatever, she didn't. UNTIL ................ last night, right about dark, she called. Tossed the phone over to DH to answer it (remember, I don't answer her calls, when he's here). She called it turns out with the following: "I so didn't want to call you and bother you on Father's Day but my toilets .. both of them are plugged up". He asked if it can wait til today, she confirmed it can.
I asked him later ( because I'm beginning to wonder, does she do this on purpose so she can summon some other life-form to visit her .. it seems to happen with A LOT of frequency. We have 3 people living in our home flushing toilets routinely ...and DD and her crew coming and going a LOT .. and we, fortunately, don't seem to ever bump into plugged up toilets .. ever .. and MIL seems to, every few weeks, .. WTH?!?!?!).
I asked him, "what's up with her system over there, that she keeps having this problem every few weeks".
He says it's because her plumbing lines don't have enough fall on them ............. need to bust up the concrete all through her house and replace the drainage lines .. a massive .. hugely expensive and messy/horrible undertaking to have to do.
Thus I guess, he will just have to resign himself to going every few weeks to clear plugged up plumbing.
He said, this morning, heading out to work, as he was pondering his schedule for the day, "this is so unfair that I have to go to her house .. it's like every week, with some damn problem or the other .. she needs to get out of that house".
I only responded "yep", and let it go at that.
The constant need. It's either her, her house or her dog, constantly.
MIL has them conditioned to jump for the trivial stuff...but hands off the REAL stuff.
Hang tough lady!
That was so sad, the whole post. Poor DH, can't even have a nice Father's Day b/c his thoughts are so wound up with MIL and her endless, soul sucking needs. I am glad you guys got to go out, that was a good thing. Too bad you couldn't have just gone w/o all the dithering and discussion.
Your MIL has so inculcated herself into the fabric of your lives that it's like you can't have a simple thought about where to go eat w/o taking her into consideration.
There's not much to say about that...I am sure your DH has such mixed feelings about his mother. Mine sure does. He cannot stand her, but is so torn about feeling responsible for her---she also makes up stuff for him to do, should he ever drop by, which is as infrequent as humanly possible---and then it always ends up with her talking about how horrible he was as a child, or something, and he comes home & is so much more depressed. He cannot outgrow the "rotten child" syndrome that she has so carefully taught him he is. The GUILT he has over just existing and ruining her life is incredible--and he's 66 years old!! He's never going to be "ok" about this.
I feel for your DH, he puts up a tough front, but I know in his heart he is crying with frustration, pain and anger.
Hopefully the "plans" for SIL to take MIL and fly away to IL for a few months will come to fruition and you two can have a life.
(BTW, my DH, if I say the same thing twice to him, reminding him (he is deaf) tells me to STOP MICROMANAGING MY LIFE.) His anger is at his mother, not you. Not fair, but then, what in our lives IS??
And how very unfair it was to YOU to be the one who was expected to do all the steppin' and fetchin' for MIL for years. Hours on the road with and for her. But no one thought how unfair it was for you doing all of that!
Frustrating and absurb as well is the fact that they fail to see or take into consideration this impact - the toll it is taking on everyone else’s life.
But they get get what they want - don’t they?
"But she's so happy, and in the end, that's what matters, now run along now and make sure those toilets are in good working order, so she can be HAPPY"
"But .. isn't that the choice you guys agree with? Wait .. I thought that's the choice you guys made, that she wants to be in her home, yea stinks you have to run there ever few days to button down yet one more issue in her home .. but ya know .. it's all about her being happy, right?".
So much I could've said. But to do so only incites animosity. He's not stupid .. he has to know the same conclusions I do. He will just have to walk the walk of being there .. all the time, for all this "need" .. and come to the conclusion himself. Implicit in leaving her to be "happy" in her own home, is gonna come fraught with ... her dog needs management, she needs management, and more importantly that home needs upkeep and management, .. so .. either work to change it, or get to steppin.
(I try to be mindful that while I might see all this as so unbelievably confounding and maddening, not being an offspring of MIL's .. and find it all far too over the top. That's not necessarily the view from where DH sits as the son of this woman. She is, to him, to be pitied, didn't ask to get old and frail and a problem .. she is .. someone who at one time was vibrant and took care of him .. and raised him. Not at all the perspective I come at it with, but I try to be mindful that is his experience, his reality .. and being a mean smart azz about it, doesn't help, and so try not to be).
Every time I'd see her, I'd comment, innocuously, about some aspect of where she lived. " so sad that there's no sidewalks in your neighborhood. It makes taking walks so unsafe". " it's so isolated here during the day. No one is at home". " it's too bad there's no public transportation here".
Not argumentative. Just pointing out the facts.
You can do this with DH as well. " Yes, it's sad that her house in such poor repair". "it's troublesome that you have to be responsible for so much home maintenance and repair for mom, on top of all your other responsibilities". " " it's really tragic that no one can talk to her about moving to a more suitable environment where her needs could be addressed".
Just neutral, fact based statements. No snark. No " tone".
But yes, in points to DH .. "yes, I agree shame her home is in such bad shape that you have to constantly run to fix something all the time".
Color me astounded, I was anyway, not anymore.
I am fixing a spread today for DH's bday and having all the kids over .. and g'kids. Had DD reach out to MIL .. to see if she'd like to be picked up and brought over to join in. Per DD .. yes, she would love that, if we'd send YD to come get her, just give her some notice .. so she can be ready.
Astounded.
But then, fast forward an hour or so, phone rings here ... and it's MIL. She's just not able to do it. Still in her PJ's .. went to the back to try to get dressed, and just isn't strong enough to even do that. No, we don't mind if she comes in her PJ's and said as much .. but she would never (vanity). She just isn't able to do it, she says ... she says she'd love to come and be able to enjoy the babies ..and all of us all together, but she just is not able to do it. More than she can do.
Oh well .. I tried ....
DH upset, . "yea but she'll get in her car and drive it, having gotten dressed, .. if her dog needs something".
Oh well, chalk it up to good days/bad days, she has em. We all do, more pronounced in the elderly and infirm I'd say.