I've posted before about in-law care-giving. Aged mother in law, lives in same town.
We are at the tail end of a visit from sister in law from several states away. Sister in law has been here for 3 weeks caring for her mother. A much welcome respite.
It had been discussed, prior to her arrival here on the scene, she would be talking it over with her mother, to try and get her mom to come up to her home, for a stay of maybe a few months.
This, in my opinion, is absolutely essential, as I am expecting twin grand-children, due in about 1 month (if they don't come sooner, as is the case a lot of times with multiples pregnancies). The expectant mother also lives locally here, and has a 4 year old daughter. I will be on that front, helping .. as much as is needed. And not on the front with mother in law and care-giving, and have made that as obvious and apparent as I know how to make it. It would be great if mother in law would agree to go to her daughter's home (several states away) for a period of a few months .. and allow me the latitude to put my energies where I want them to be, on my daughter who will have had a c-section .. and my grand-daughter (4 years old) and new twin babies.
Nothing doing. Mother in law has dug in her heels, and will not hear of it, going to stay with her daughter for any period of time.
What are her reasons?
In mother in law's defense ... her daughter ... I don't even know how to describe it. I will say that when her daughter comes here to visit, she all but breathes for her mother and if she could find a way to do that, she'd do that too. She is the most nervous nelly, never sit down - ever ... worry wart, do everything, all the time .. person that I've ever encountered.
A great example, as I was taking her to the airport yesterday for her departure, . I reached into the fridge to grab myself a bottled water and shut the fridge and turned to walk away, as I've done for all of my 50 plus years living on this earth .. and she said to me, "Oh make sure that fridge shut". WTH???? Like I don't know how to shut a fridge? That's just a small, very small slice of what she is ... how she is.
She is so very hyper-vigilant, seeing to every minute details down to it's finest most minuscule point, fine tooth comb, questioning every point along the way, "should we do thus and so, but maybe if we do thus and so, then such and such will happen, maybe we should do it thus and so .. but then so and so might happen, maybe we shouldn't do thus and so, but do "x" "y" and "z" instead, but if we don't do it that way then ..........", on and on and on and on it goes. And usually in hyper warp speed, as to every single friggin thing.
If her mother moans .. "what's wrong mother?, why did you moan, are you alright?".
Mother: "Yes, I'm fine, I was just sighing out loud".
Sister: "Why did you sigh? Are you hurting, are you sure you're alright, why are you sighing what's the matter?"
Mother: "For God's sake __________________, I was just sighing, .. calm down, I'm fine".
Sister: "Are you sure, .. because if something is wrong you need to tell me".
Mother: "Everything is fine, I'm fine".
Sister: "Are you sure, we did a lot yesterday, did we do too much, maybe we shouldn't of gone to two doctors in one day .. was that too much for you, are you too tired now, maybe we need to move those other doctor appointments so we won't have two in one day, is that too much for you, for one day .. is that why you were sighing .. what's wrong, are you sure you're alright".
Hopefully that kinda gives a little bit of a snapshot of what goes on when sister is in the ring directing things.
So in mother in law's defense.. I do get it, why she wouldn't be chomping at the bit to go to her daughter's home.
BUT ....
The only experience she has with her daughter, in the last years as mother in law has aged and been unable to go anywhere much, has been the daughter coming here, periodically, for periods of about 3 weeks at a stretch. When her daughter comes here, she moves heaven and earth for her mother and then some, and doesn't sit down, doesn't stop .. the WHOLE ENTIRE TIME.
Is there a possibility maybe (as I said to mother in law, when she expressed that isn't happening - talking to me - her going to her daughters .. ever) .. could it be possible that maybe if you would go to where she lives .. she'd be more busy managing her own life in that setting than your's and she would get out of your backside .. and not be as hyper-drive-vigilant as you experience in her, when she's here, could that be possible.
The daughter is retired, lives several states away. Does come here, generally, every few months .. and stays for a period of about 3 weeks at a stretch. I wish I could make a list of everything the daughter did when here this last time, but it would take up the whole character allotment:
Amen. I’ve read the following here several times but never used it until now:
“Been there. Got the T-shirt.” I also have the hat and the mug. It nearly was the breaking of me. Boundaries? That word applied to maps, property and rules in Hide and Seek as a child.
Both my parents had a significant, life-changer of medical crisises at the same time - as I’ve mentioned before. Mentioned a lot. Cause it’s a big frickin’ ordeal - one is bad enough. But both at the same time? Forget about it!
But you, Dorker - have
circumstances that differ from mine and that should be a bit of a floatation device - K is not your mother and K has a daughter of her own. A daughter, you’ve mentioned - who has benefited in numerous ways, curtesy of her mother... and your father must have agreed with. Ways in which your did not benefit.
Im not saying that as a recipient of said benefits K’s daughter is indebted - well, maybe I am. Just a bit. Really, its more - she’s been there while times were good - easier - now it’s time to show it wasn’t all about the condo or potential inheritances. It just what a decent person would do. IMO. So far, K’s daughter has been there. So far. But truth of the matter is - in fact, this chit ball rolling down hill hasn’t even begun to pick up speed. But it will. Count on it.
Where I see this really becoming a complicated problem is - dad and K are a package deal. At some point - it’s gonna need to be addressed as to THEIR care and THEIR future as a long-time, married couple. K’s daughter can’t be doing one thing with her mother while you’re doing something else with your dad. Not for much longer, that is. Dad and K won’t stand for that. They aren’t THERE. Yet.
Your fathers responses that - yes, they have hired out for help with the yard and with the cleaning... and yes, K is accepting a weekend caregiver “for his sake” and that’s enough... smells a little bit like “I
know what needs to be done and I’ll do it”. And Dorker, you KNOW how the second verse to that song and dance goes.
If I were you, Dorker - I’d start drawing up some of those well earned and learned boundaries. I’d start planning for the conversation that needs to happen with your dad. It doesn’t have to happen today but I’ll bet it’s gonna have to happen sooner than you think.
With K’s daughter already taking small steps towards her own boundaries - of which she’s entitled - you are definitely gonna need to start taking steps towards yours.
...least you be swallowed into the abyss.
Side note to Riverdale: Thanks for the nice compliment. You’re sweet!
No further push on the will? Don't you think it needs to be pushed? And what about a health care POA?
I'm glad you've stepped back a bit from dad-duty at the rehab. Your actions as described here were starting to sound like steppin' and fetchin' ala SIL. You checked on K once to appease your father. Why? And he thinks K's daughter is selfish because she is leaving for the weekend? What's he going to think of YOU if you don't do everything he wants?
Isn't this the father who distanced himself from you and your younger brother when he got remarried? And didn't he treat his stepdaughter better than the two of you when you were growing up?
Be very careful. I can see your becoming mired in dad-duty very quickly.
CTTN55 brings up very good points regarding the will. Of lack there of.
Dad wont push doing a Will because it upsets K. Is that perhaps, because it upsets K’s plan to funnel EVERYTHING to her daughter? And, in my book at least - Dad doesn’t get a pass. By doing nothing, Dad is guilty of the “sin of omission”. In this case, nothing is the same as agreeing - with K’s plan.
Now, you might say it isn’t about money - caring for you father. Okay.
However, Dorker - before you run yourself into the ground and turn yourself inside out on your fathers behalf - I suggest considering the old saying - as it applies to your fathers inaction regarding a Will - “It’s the thought that counts”.
That's IT. That's the extent of your response.
Yes, I intend, in the coming days, now that my dad is certainly more alert, becoming better ambulatory (walker), more engaged in the world around him....talk to him about the cancer dx, the MPOA & DPOA and Wills, and keep hammering @ alternate living arrangements.
Fortunately their financial situation will allow them some options MIL didnt have.
If he cant get his miserly procrastinator always wife on board in the coming weeks (truthfully I dont see him achieving it)... I dont know what to say.
As I said of his wife ... she acts as though spending $ is her last dollar she'll ever have. Firmly dug in, a lifetime spent living that way.
I wish they'd sell their 2 story home and use the proceeds to get into an AL & more to the point, one where transition to MC can be on site ultimately.
Getting she who wont spend $ and doesn't admit nor dx'd with Dementia, to agree to the above.
Dont see him achieving it.
The only thing I can do is push him to do as needed & then guard my boundaries.
I dont happen to fall in lock step agreement with my dad that K's daughter is selfish for returning to her home for the weekend. She SHOULD do just that IMO.
The fact stepmom initially refused in home paid care giver still shouldn't impede step sisters plans to go to her own home for the weekend.
These are issues the two of them need to address realistically and deal with head on. Depending on her daughter to exit her own life because she finds having an on site paid caregiver not palatable. Maybe stepmom refusing same might of resulted in a night or two in a psych ward when she then becomes addled/frightened/confused/frantic in the middle of the night.
Stepmom has no memory at all of being transferred a week or so ago to another site for rehab, a step down if you will from a rehab with a medical focus to the point her medical issues no longer as pressing, now transferred to a step down just straight inpatient rehab.
There is where her disorientation/frantic/panic/ confusion kicked in. Complaining of shortness of breath, chest pressure... carted outta there and to ER.
Her begging to go home.
She was actually at the same site where my dad is now inpatient rehab.
She doesn't know of that site (even though she was most certainly there, at least a few hours, before having been sent to the ER).
Has zero memory of any of that scene. Even when coached, it's not there in her memory bank.
She has no memory of the event that led to her being carted from home via rescue personnel summoned by my dad, chest pains. Ultimate result emergency bypass surgery.
It's especially difficult to get someone like her .. no memory of the difficulties nor awareness of what she doesn't remember .. get her to agree she needs different living arrangements.
Is your father one to avoid conflict at all costs? Is this why he won't overrule your stepmother in important matters such as doing a will? In getting in-home help?
I wonder just how much you can push him. He's had his way of living for so long, and so just how much will you, a daughter he hasn't had that much contact with, be able to influence him?
Be prepared to guard your boundaries, as you wrote above. And don't make those boundaries ones that will be ripe for mission creep. When he asked you to go check on K in the hospital (or was it rehab), you readily went to do just that. Be very careful of doing what your father wants you to do without very firm boundaries that you are ready to enforce.
K doesn't want in-home help. But she would probably agree to having YOU come and do things at some point. And that is what you do not want.
Consider taking a very strong stance along the lines of not helping out at all unless he gets the legal stuff done, gives you HCPOA, agrees to in-home help (whether or not K wants it), or even agrees to some kind of permanent placement for K.
You have come so far in the past two years with regards to MIL. Don't then turn around and become the stepandfetchit for your father just because he is your biological parent whereas MIL was just an in-law. Look at the big picture -- his history with you, his refusal to do the sensible things, etc. Being a biological parent does NOT outweigh everything else.
The bottom line here in all of this .. and I'm fully aware of it. Were K firing on all cylinders, .. as she has been throughout their 50 years of marriage .. and dad befallen with illness or injury .. I would likely be very much on the periphery of it all. Not a doubt in my mind.
THE ONLY REASON I WAS EVEN made aware at all, of her Dementia (otherwise I'd of not known it, not been privy to that info. Is because . when dad had his back surgery, long awaited back surgery back in February .. and .. at that point . almost anyone with a modicum of a brain cell would deduce he'd need to be discharged to a rehab now, to work on his strength and ambulating. He wasn't going in that direction, he was going home. And .. rather obvious also at that time, K was staying with him around the clock at the hospital.
One might think, oh how endearing .. she's staying right by his side during his hospital confinement. And I probably would've thought just that . .and nothing more. But I was let into the inner fold of the privacy that has always been pervasive . at that point. She stays there around the clock, at the hospital because she has developed some Dementia. Staying home alone, ... disorients/confuses her, causes her to become frantic .. and panicky.
I hadn't known, prior to that . there was even any shred of any Dementia. Likely I'd of never been brought into that inner fold .. were both players up and functional. So dad discharged from hospital .. and to home .. and it's said that K's daughter will be on site helping. And the reason for his going home vs Rehab .. is because K can't be left alone .. her dementia.
In the process of all that is when it also comes to light .. more so than I'd ever been aware . .that K's daughter . tends to be flighty . and her relationship with her mom a bit contentious .. and is prone for departing on a moment's notice, having gotten her nose out of joint (which happens often between she and her mom, I've learned).
I didn't know all this "stuff". I'd rather live the rest of my life, not knowing this "stuff".
The high points to the ancient history in all this.
My bio parents divorced when I was a little one, .. I guess maybe 5 or 6 yo.
I and my bio brother lived with my mom at first. My earliest memories of that time frame . sketchy though they are, (it was a long time ago) .. I do remember being poor as church mice, .. and sometimes having nothing to eat, in the house.
My bio mom would tell it .. (I can't dispute the fact, I was too little to know any different) . .that my dad screwed, blue'd and tattoo'd her in the divorce and .. left her with little to nothing in the way of any child support.
I believe that to have likely been the case. That would've been in the 60's and in that day men were king .. in the courts.
I remember at some point in all that, .. my brother and myself now went to live with what was my bachelor dad, no longer residing with my mom. My mom would tell it, . .later .. (at the time I was too young to process the inner workings of it all) .. that was done because she couldn't afford us .. and my dad had made sure of that .. in getting it decreed that his child support monthly payments were nominal at best.
I can't imagine my dad so wanted the care of these two little urchins . .. that he designed it that way via nominal child support. I doubt that seriously. Probably what he valued more . was the $'s he was having to dole out now. Would be about my guess.
I remember going to first grade, a resident of my mom's house. 2nd, 3rd grade a resident of my bachelor dad. By 4th grade, .. we moved, .. my dad, myself and my bio brother, ..
In the 4th grade (that's how I place it all, what grade levels . vs .. what age I was) .. we were living in a different home .. and I now had a stepmom (one I'd never met before) and a stepsister.
This was the late 60's early 70's .. and I'd like to think that people have evolved since then, as their emotional intelligence. Bringing blended families together needs to be a lot more incorporated than what was done in the above. I would hope things have evolved since that time, .. and kids are made more a part of bringing a "new parent" into their world. But that's not how it was done in my world, at that time.
Was probably more common in that time . that kids were an afterthought and how they process what it is that impacts their world.
Lived with dad and stepmom, 4th, 5th and 6th grades.
7th grade .. we (bio brother and myself) then moved .. to now live w/bio mom and stepdad.
Stayed living with my bio mom and stepdad from there forward.
Those formative years spent living with my dad .. I don't really remember much about the days of bachelorhood and what was life living under his charge.
I do remember more, . about the year there was a stepmom involved. I remember, my dad traveled a lot, which left bio brother and myself in her charge .. stepmom's. I remember, there was very much favoritism .. with the stepsister .. and it was palpable, even at that time. Not much one can do as a child, as to any recourse.
From 7th grade onward . my relationship and involvement as to my dad . was every-other-weekend .. (summers we were summarily shipped off .. the day school ended, . to the grandmother in the state of KY . and brought back the day before school started). All of this .. until I got a little bit older and began to have weekend baby sitting duties, to earn $'s . and/or a life of my own, friends, dating, etc. Then the weekends .. weren't really on the table any longer, as I was older and had a life of my own.
It wasn't the big happy blended family kinda setting. Not a situation where let's say .. the plan would be over the summers . there'd be a big family vacation and off we'd go with dad and stepmom to Disney for the week or whatever. There wasn't any of that.
I graduated high school, was working had my own friends/life .. and from there forward . about any involvement with my dad .. and his world, was bdays and Father's Day . his bday and mine. That was about the only time I had any proximity to visits/time with him and his world, and he mine.
Got married, started a family . and the rest is history.
It would become apparent through the years (but that was nothing new) .. when we'd see him (see above, bdays and xmas/father's day, that's about it) .. that there was "involvement" . in the world of K's daughter and K's grandkids .. that much one would deduce by being around my dad and K . and them talking of what K's grandkids are doing, swim meets, .. baseball games, .. yadda yadda.
That wasn't the case here, .. my dad a part of coming to swim meets for my kids, and or ballgames. But I wasn't inviting him either. Who knows if he'd of come had I done so. I didn't.
Why didn't I? I don't know, . I don't guess there was a strong bond built there. My world was full . I had my own life/responsibilities . my kids had their involvements . and the people in their lives that cared about them.
That's the history of it all. I have never been an "insider" to their world, and it's worked out just fine all these years. I don't need to be. What works for them and their marriage, their world . is fine by me.
But I also don't intend to become a carbon copy of SIL . and be jumping to the beat of "need" on their end. And that will become clear when I talk to my dad dad about some of the things, .. as I see them, . that need to be addressed in his world . head on .. and their responsibility to sort through.
I think my dad's hope . and we'll see how this all pans out . is that they can both regain their footing, he and his wife both.
I think it worked . for a while ..
She with diminished function in her brain/mind . and he the other half of that quotient. He . diminished function as to his physical well being, in a MRSA infection that went on far too long (over a year) . and a back in desperate need of surgical repair . prohibited because of active MRSA ongoing. She .. his arms/legs .. driver, to doc appts., . etc. etc. It worked .. .
BUT ....................
Then .. within the last couple of months it all fell off the rails. In stepmom's emergency bypass operation .. and my dad recooping at that time from the long awaited back surgery . .not yet ambulatory in full. Her now down for the count, . and him stumbling along .. trying . absent his wife's presence as to other half to his inability. Then, of course, is when he got bronchitis that rapidly went to pneumonia . and collapsed lungs, .. and a cancer dx that remains out there unspoken of . thus far.
She now recooping from bypass surgery . and him in Rehab recooping from his latest calamities.
I think it's his hope they can put it all back on the rails .. K now able to drive again .. (that brain of her's is not what it should be and it won't get better) . but I think he envisions he can be other other half of that missing quotient, as it has been. Get her back to firing on what cylinders she does have. He . also .. if he can get back to firing on the cylinders he's capable of . which . if he can get past rehabbing from all this .. and the back that never fully got rehabbed . and get more ambulatory (the cancer dx and it's impact to all this remains unanswered to at this point) .. then the two of them can "complete" one another as to the shortcomings of each in their maladies.
We'll have to see how that pans out. I don't know . they are both 80 yo. They aren't 50.
It's my view ... some of that may in fact return to a more normal ... some of it. But this is the big red flashing warning sign .. cautioning what is to come . and it needs attention . and now .. as to .. "you guys . neither of you are getting younger and the big flashing red warning sign . is showing you . .this needs attention and new direction as to how your path forward should look .. ".
Whether they choose to get on board and address it (I don't see it happening with his wife .. ) . whether he chooses to stand down and defer to her thinking .. and procrastination (always procrastinating) .. and that in the end leaves them both with their pants down . as to their well being .. he's going to need to understand that.
What they do have in their favor is that they both worked hard all their lives and saved for this eventuality. The financial piece in all of this, won't be the problem it was for MIL.
If K refuses to have in home . paid c'givers .. and that then puts more onus on my dad than he is able to carry .. that's going to have to be on him to sort thru whether he pushes that agenda. It's not going to be me stepping in to mind K .. and her well being . and running that treadmill. I'm not going to be another SIL to their need. I simply won't do it.
Will I cart my dad ... in these coming weeks . as K continues convalescing .. to his various doc appts .. yes I will. Will I also be agreeable . and insist that his paid c'givers do so at times. Yep.
Will I run the roads daily making sure their meds are on board .. and their meals are nutritious and wholesome . nope. If they have reached a juncture where that can be seen to and needs to be seen to outside of their abilities . .then that's what I'm talking about, they need to make other arrangements as to their well being.
There are some difficult conversations .. and uncomfortable for me, . as these are two people .. very much so . that I've been left .. all these years on the periphery.
So what about K... If he won't do what's needed for his affairs, it does have an effect on you and your future. It makes it much harder going forward, as you received a little taste when rehab wouldn't give you info. I would cut back to infrequent visits until he decides he can talk to the atty and get his business done.
In my opinion, it's not just K who's the tightwad cheapskate. Any man who wouldn't give his ex wife support enough to keep the children goes beyond mean. He's demonstrating his current meanness with the nurses, yet you look beyond it. He doesn't deserve you. Use your time with him as leverage to get what needs to be done legally with him. Otherwise, once a week visits are appropriate just to see a mean old man you happen to know. You are sacrificing time with your grands for a mean man who wouldn't take care of YOU in your childhood.
This is the event that to a reasoning person would cause them to say "okay, I see, we can no longer live at home; my wife needs more and DIFFERENT care than can be given in a home setting and my undying desire to PLEASE her rather than get her what she needs is going to be problematic. And I probably have a fatal illness; I need to think of her needs going forward and how to arrange all this. And heavens knows, I can't ask my daughter, someone I all but abandoned in childhood, to give us the kind of care we need. "
That's what a reasonable, loving person would be saying/doing.
It's not a good way to be. It's hard on your body and hard on your mental health.
I know you said that your therapist retired; have you looked into to finding someone new, perhaps someone who works with Cognitive Behavior Therapy techniques?
When I was a child I had the crystal clear knowledge that my parents were eff’ed up people in a beyond eff’ed up relationship and marriage.
Due to the sound level of their fighting - the whole neighborhood, along with the local police station, knew it too. Which, of course only made things worse.
My mother would come crying to me - pouring out her sadness, hate and anxiety - as one might do with a trained marriage counselor. The problem was - this started when I was about 8 yrs old. It didn’t stop until I was in my late 30’s and I finally had the nerve to tell her to stop. This man was my father and I loved him. It was cruel and inappropriate- and I didn’t want to hear it. Testament to my mothers tenacity - she still tried. As soon as I heard “I know you don’t want to hear this, but...”, I knew where she was heading. Mom did this until the day my dad died. I was 50 then.
Anyhoo - back in the beginning, when I was still a child, I would beg my mother to seek a divorce. I was desperate for the yelling and screaming - the random flying objects, the embarrassment of EVERYONE knowing, the solitude of never having a friend come to my house... I was desperate for it to stop. But my mother always had her reasons - why they couldn’t divorce. Looking back, I believe it was just their eff’ed up, codependent relationship. Neither WANTED to divorce.
A couple of years ago - after both my parents had passed, I asked my brother “Do you ever think about - wonder about - how our lives might have been different if they had divorced when we were still young children?”. He replied “No, not really. I think if that had happened - we would just have a different set of issues”.
I had never really looked at it from that perspective. A different set of issues - maybe better, maybe worse. But certainly issues - as that’s who our parents were. Together or separate. Some people just shouldn’t have children, I guess.
Recently, a robin built a nest on a beam just outside my bedroom window. I watched mom laying the first twig of her nest until yesterday - when the babies took flight. For five weeks I’ve been enthralled- mesmerize by what good parents the mom and dad robin are. Working together to feed their babies, keeping them warm and teaming up to chase away predators. More than once, I found myself thinking “It’s too bad some human parents can’t be more like these robins”.
I was kinda sad to see my birds go. But, still happy and amazed to have been able to witness it all. My husband asked me “Do you think they’ll still hang out together - stay nearby and we’ll see them?” I replied that - yeah, I’ve read that they tend to stay in a familiar environment. And then I said, “But you’ll never see Mama robin bitchin’ at her babies “Now, you take care of me. Where are MY worms?””
Yep. It’s too bad more parents can’t be like my robins.
I have been so inspired by this thread, your writing Dorker & the replies. Hugs to you.
surprise touched on something I've been wondering about....what's the story with his avoidance of acknowledging his diagnosis? All this talk about him getting stronger to better handle it. How long has it been now? It didn't occur to me that it could be a way to keep Dorker closely involved.
So, let's see...years ago he made sure he used an attorney to impoverish Dorker's mother after the divorce, thereby hurting his two children, who sometimes didn't have anything to eat because of his selfishness. And now he's refusing to utilize an attorney to get his affairs in order, to the (probable) detriment of Dorker once again. There is really no excuse for him.
Was on site yesterday, having gone to his home, retrieve a form that needs to be completed and mailed in. Something to do with their retiree health bene's . and the company pays it, .. .but one has to submit forms each month to enact that process. Had gone by his house, to retrieve said form, to take it to him, for him to complete and then I'd drop it in the mail for him.
The big hullabaloo of the moment, was this. The day before, I'd been notified they were gonna discharge on Sunday. This was Thursday, the day after the care plan meeting, where it was made plain to all involved, he needs to continue working on some balance issues (new) . and strength, stamina, endurance, etc.
We'd been to the care plan meeting on Wednesday, suddenly by Thursday . "he's ready to go home now". My pushback on that issue was met with, "those are items that can be addressed via home PT .. and we'll assign home services".
I pushed back. He has a wife at home recovering from bypass surgery .. and is not able to help her, nor she him. As was said in the meeting .. he needs to continue to work on endurance, strength, stamina . .and .. the home environment isn't as conducive as is here.
This was Thursday this got presented. My pushback was met with . from case manager, "I'll take your concerns back to the team and see if we can get an extension . and I'll call you back".
No call back.
Tried calling her yesterday AM .. as I traveled to dad's house, to pick up the needed form. Only got voice mail, left a message.
Then arrived at dad's rehab .. and got that form completed and dealt with . and then the hunt was on. Tried to go find the case manager, to speak with her, . found her office, but she wasn't at her desk. Was told by nearby staff, . she's here, she's traveling around somewhere in the site .. we'll let her know you're looking for her. Asked that they send her to my dad's room .. that I'd be there a while.
In a little while, .. the PT guy dad works with daily .. he appeared. "Hi, so and so sent me, . it's time to work on PT . but she wanted me to let you know that the team met, and he's ready to go home . there's really no further reason to keep him here".
I pushed back again .. as did my dad.
(BTW . bears mentioning, his hateful mean demeanor has eased some. He is no longer as snippy and harsh as he was when he got there). There are things that annoy him . and he speaks up about it. For instance, the gal came in to put his lunch tray down on the table, . and on that table, were his eyeglasses .. his box of kleenex, a few books he's working on, . a pamphlet of some sort, .. and file folder. My dad was laying in his bed at this point (he isn't always . he is up and about in the wheelchair at times) . but at this point, he was laying in his bed. The gal began to clear the table, by placing the items onto the bed, . at his feet . I guess an effort to make room to put the lunch tray down. My dad took exception with that . and I guess called her on it. I don't blame him. He wasn't mean/hateful, but did .. at least correct her, that he doesn't wish his various sundry items placed at his feet on the bed, . that she can either neatly stack them on the other end of the tray table, or put them on his nightstand . or ask him to move the items and he'll gladly do so, but don't just toss them onto his feet there on the bed.
But in general, he is no longer as mean, more engaged now, more alert.
But, this PT guy .. now announcing on behalf of the case manager . who I guess thought it suitable to send him with word, . that no. team has met . and he's suitable for discharge, can be sent home on Sunday. Turns to now work with my dad to get him up and moving to go to PT.
I took exception . asked to speak to case manager, citing that I'd now left 2 voice mails for her, had gone to her office to look for her, . and that I'm not
That I'm not okay with discharge on Sunday, that I appreciate him coming to share that news, but that I'd like to speak to her, instead, the case manager.
He picked up his bat phone or whatever it is they use there, .. shot her a text, I guess . that's what it looked like he was doing. Said he'd sent her a note . and she'd be around to talk to us .. and that we can head on now to PT .
Asked if I'd like to accompany . so that I can see for myself, he is doing well enough to go home. He is no longer on O2 I was reminded .. and his oxymetry measures consistently within normal ranges as does his BP .. and heart rate, even at exertion. I guess, these things mentioned to me in an effort to quell any concern as to sending him home.
A bit later the case manager found us .. and the word again, .. "No he really can work on these things from home, there is no longer any need for him to stay here".
This (my dad was in agreement and voicing his own opinions that jive with what I was saying on the topic) .. I responded to, "Look we met on Wednesday and agreed, all of us . that he needs to continue working on strength, balance, stamina .. that was on Wednesday .. so now by Thursday he's ready to go home on a Sunday discharge, that gives him only an add'l 3 days to work on the above items.
She looks at chart, .. notes that the PT team had recommended an add'l week there . but doctor had over-ridden it. I asked to speak to the doctor that made that decision.
I was then given a form, and explained to me, that I can appeal the decision with Medicare if I'd like, her's the 1-800# ...
Asked about it being a holiday weekend and the response time that I could expect, if any. It was explained they work 24/7 . and someone will get back with me . and if not .. then on Sunday . he can either self pay to continue to stay . or he can go home . those are his choices . but that generally . contacting this # to file an appeal .. will bring about an answer in 24/48 hours.
We went on to PT . and I observed. He did have to take several breaks . and his oxymetry was measured, as well as BP .. .and heart rate, all checking out okay even though he was fatigued and having to stop and rest. But still .. I stood firm .. I don't think he's ready for the home environment.
So we get back from PT and I go about the steps of filing the appeal over the phone. The rep explains someone will get back to me, likely by tomorrow (today) .. as to the answer.
I then turn to my dad, ..
My conversation with him: "So dad . not likely they'll be reversing this decision and so it's likely they will send you outta here on Sunday. My suggestion is that you reach out to J (the paid caregiver that stays with K .. when the daughter exits) .. and with R (another paid caregiver that was on site, to assist my dad while K was in the hospital . and he was off the rails fighting bronchitis that turned into pneumonia and was subsequently hospitalized) .. my suggestion . you need to be in contact w/ J and with R both . and see what it is you can work out as to getting on site c'giver .. at least for a couple of weeks until you guys . both you and K, can better stand on your own two feet.
The response from him: an acknowledgement by shaking his head yes . and then stating that yes, he'd be doing that, and get the necessary measures in place if need be..
Me: "And beyond that .. you need to be mindful ... let's talk about K .. and her dementia .. you're a smart guy . you know this isn't gonna get better . it's gonna get far worse .. and so .. you're going to need to be putting in place what it is you think .. as to how to best address all this. You need to be considering that you both will need to be in a facility for your care . and be working towards that goal .. I will help you .. if you'd like, .. but .. the time has come that has to be considered, . and it's MO . that K will do far better to make that transition .
To make that transition now while she is somewhat more lucid . and while you can go also . together.
Dad: "we both have LTC coverage and I am going to need to get at that policy and look at it's provisions .. I know that it has a six month waiting period . and so .. that much I do know, but some of what has already transpired . may count for that ... I'll need to look it over. It's something that I am keenly aware of . and have been for some time . that it's coming .. and so .. I do understand and have an awareness as to some measures that are going to need to be taken".
Me: "And dad .. as to the whole picture here, . w/her Dementia oncoming . you need to be thinking about how you'd like to designate as MPOA and DPOA .. and I will do that if you'd like, but it's something that has to be addressed. She is going to get to where she is not capable of making decisions on her behalf of yours .. that's coming .. and I don't know . maybe she'd like to designate her daughter as her MPOA and DPOA . but those are things that need to be sorted out .. ".
Dad, some acknowledgement that it will be problematic assigning K's daughter who can be flighty and a bit of a flake at times as to her mom and her mom's well being .. and then: "Yes, .. I know I have some homework in front of me, .. all of this you're talking about . all of it . has been on my mind . for quite some time .. it's nothing new .. but yes, there are things I'm going to have to get up to speed and address".
Me: "I have a good attorney for elder affairs and I'm sure he'll gladly come talk to you.".
<and heretofore, the dreaded "C" dx . had not been tabled for discussion . but now that it looked as though he's gonna be sent outta there on Sunday .. I felt .. okay .. strike while the iron is hot. Hated to do it . as he does fatigue easily these days . .and one could see that, he'd just endured PT . and had to take several breaks . only to land back now in his room and daughter now barking at him as to homework coming up .. life changing events that need his attention. But .. his wife also doesn't know of this dreaded "C" dx .. and thus far, .. the opportunity had not come up for me to share it either .. I haven't been there around the clock all day long . as I'd been when he was hospitalized. Generally breezing in .. between PT & OT .. and not staying long. So . no time like the present, to put that on the table also.
Me: And dad . there is the matter of your upcoming doctor visit to Oncology . we haven't talked about that piece of it, . but here's the rub on that. The pathology came back that you have Squamous cell Lung Cancer in that mass in your upper right lung .. "
He interrupted .. "that's what I get all over my arms and head all the time and has to be frozen off:.
Me: That's what I said to the oncology doc . but no . it's not common at all, . in fact, one has nothing to do with the other .. not like that squamous cell cancer you had on your arm somehow metastasized to your lung . not the case. Not at all related. But the story on that front, you have an appt upcoming with the oncology doc .. and they will then set it up for you to have a PET scan to stage it. They want to check to make sure it hasn't metastasized. What I know, .. is that if it's limited to only the mass in your lung, it can be targeted with radiation. If it has spread .. the story changes . .. that the general approach would be chemo . but they question your viability to withstand that aggressive an approach . and so these are all things that need to be answered to . and you have an appt with oncology where all this can be discussed.
He acknowledged what was said, there as no drama no fanfare. I guess, just absorbing what was said to him.
Me: And so dad . the above items that we discussed .. there is some haste that needs to be applied here. We don't know yet what is in the cards for your future .. but .. if this turns dire .. it's gonna be
It's gonna be imperative these items are dealt with .. if something should happen to you .. what of K and her situation .. she needs to be in a setting where she can get the care she's going to need . but you .. more than likely with your battle ahead . may not be in a position any longer to adequately care for her .. and I don't think she's going to be in any position either to continue caring for you . there are some items that need your attention . and procrastinating . is not an option any longer".
Agreement from him (but fatigue and weary all over his face).
At that,.. I told him I'd been there long enough and was gonna head on out, . that I'd bring with me, next time I come some paperwork for him to read up on Squamous cell cancer . if he'd like . and that we'd await decision and phone call from on high as to the appeal. And I left.
I went to the grocery and there, rec'd a phone call from the case manager who stated that they'd gotten word of the appeal filed and had decided .. I guess before they even do what they do on their end to dispute said appeal . to go ahead and extend his stay til Friday of next week .. so he won't be discharged Sunday but Friday of that next week.
I thanked her, and that was that.
So there is important conversation w/my dad.
If there is any notion on his behalf that I am somehow gonna be the stepper/fetcher to his and K's needs . that is now clear to him . it's not going to happen . it's clear to him what my expectations are as to how he needs to meet upcoming need that needs to be addressed, as well as plans for their future.
I did offer to help him . as he works to sort these things thru, offered to reach out to the atty I have some familiarity with .. offered to help as he sorts thru ... and/or visits if he wishes . sites for placement. He is aware that I will help, . and I will. But .. I won't be the stepper/fetcher to it all.
I suspect he will drag his feet . dealing with keeping K content .. and the water hasn't hit the wheel yet as to where they the see that Dorker meant it . nothing in motion . as we move forward here and crises #42 on the horizon .. they will see that Dorker meant it .. you need to be doing "X Y and Z to get these things in writing and addressed" .. I'm not going to continue running to the rescue of two folks that need to be in a setting with professional care.
I suspect that's where it will go.
My dad is a smart man . he has his brains/functionality about him ..
All of this stuff . as he put it, . is not new . has been on his mind for quite some time. Obviously he's chosen to kick the can down the road .. "for quite some time" on it all .. and not address it. I suspect that will be the approach going forward. There's no good reason it hasn't been addressed .. that's why I suspect the same will be the case going forward. He has been . in his defense .. he fought MRSA which hobbled his ability to get around . (in his foot) for over a year. And also during that time, a bad back that hobbled his ability to get around .. and so it's not like this was a guy who had the wherewithal to get out and fish and play golf. He has been hobbled for quite some time with his different issues. His ability to get out and about . not there.
But IMO (and I said so, noting the above to him) . "all of the maladies over the past year . have now ebbed into a crescendo .. that has found you in this setting . and the PT . you desperately needed . now taking place on site . as it should've been with your back issues . and your post surgery ... we're here now . you are working to get stronger and gain back some mobility . and now . .. now there is the big red flashing caution sign in the fact that K too has gone down for the count . and so that big red caution sign that is flashing . danger ahead . has to be adhered to".
We will see.
Yes. Your dad has had a difficult year with the foot and his back. And, no -
dad hasn’t been out fishing and golfing...
Dads been home. Home with his
LTC policy - that he has been needing to read “for quite some time” And home with K - lots of time in a confined space - no one escaping out the back door - to
avoid discussing needing a will
and a DPOA. Lots of time to talk with K about moving to a more manageable housing setting.
Does Dad and K have a computer? The ability to look at legal and living options on line?
Yep. Nothing but time. However, time is now running out.
Take it from a Class A procrastinator- unless that LTC policy jumps out of the filing cabinet all by itself, trots on over to your dad and shimmies up into his lap - then yells READ ME... it ain’t gonna happen.
Has the PET Scan and Oncologist appt been scheduled yet?
Glad you had that discussion with your Dad. All the realities are fast approaching. The sooner your Dad gets to planning his and Ks future care the better.
The reality of my Stepdads Cancer dx took Moms Dementia to the next level. She literally became an unherdable cat. So many things that he could handle and tolerate and hide as far as Mom was concerned he could no longer deal with, handle and hide. Life quickly became a big ugly Circus.