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My mom had A&A when she was in AL. We had to submit paperwork from the AL as to the monthly cost, so we couldn't apply for A&A until she was signed up with the AL. Then it took seven months to receive the retroactive money, and the monthly funds. And this is with us notifying the VA that she was 91. Until the A&A came in, she had to pay the full fee out of her savings. SIL needs to be prepared to do full pay for several months until the A&A kicks in.
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I wonder if MIL just doesn't 'want' to push the call button ("mean" staff, doesn't want to be a bother, etc). I know there are a lot of things she forgets and are a little fuzzy to her, but it seems that she just won't use the call button at all for whatever reason. Sometimes things that don't make sense to us make perfect sense to them. She still remembers how to call you guys too...
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I guess anything is possible but the story about 2 aides having a fist fight in the hallway I would hope was imagined. I think I would be trying to find out if that really happened.

I agree with Guestshop, a lot of what the family is hearing is coming from MIL and no I don’t think her account of what is going on is credible for the lack of a better word.

I really don’t think she woke up whatever day and figured out I need to get myself to the Beauty Salon by 9am! Today is Beauty Salon Day!

I have to believe Chatty Cathy told her or a “nice” aide reminded her, or whoever brought her breakfast.
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My Dad lived with me for 16 months and could not tell
what time it was until he was put in a behavioral facility for
observation to see if he could be put on medicine to keep him from being so anxious. He could only call me at 3:00
everyday. He never missed calling me at straight up 3:00
everyday but while he lived with me he insisted he couldn’t tell time except at 9:00 when I had breakfast everyday and at 7:00 when it was time for dinner. I promise you if I didn’t have his plate on his tray at 7:02 he would ask where dinner was! It’s bizarre how their mind works. Very frustrating for
caregivers also.
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WorriedinCali: That's why I say it puzzles me how WAF labels itself AL. They truly are "not". Not from what I observed, .. when I visited back when SIL was in town and wanted me along to go view the place.

We'd heard from Medicaid Betty that her FIL was in that site ..and they'd been pleased with it there . .and we should go look at it.

That's when we learned that they are a "family" centered type environment and that they stake their claim to fame on the fact, they don't transition those who grow more frail and needy, outta there, they try to hang onto them. And that was very much what was observed in visiting there. The same slumpers that MIL so abhors .. they are there .. on site, in view. Some . who are .. I guess .. I didn't ask .. but maybe bedridden . as you walk around and glance in and out of rooms you pass by and you see lowered beds, . and some pour ole soul laid in a bed, . maybe they can't get out of bed, they are so old and frail.

I don't see a lot of difference .. in where MIl resides presently . and WAF .. other than WAF is a smaller setting.

So . no . not at this "AL" is there expectation they perform their own ADL's .. and ambulate appropriately to the dining area . .and so forth. Nope.

Not sure why they classify themselves as AL, .. not sure at all.

If you question that, .. with the person who walked us around, .. the owner .. who has mostly retired as a matter of fact .. she will tell you .. that they are family centered and .. try to consider each resident part of the family .. and so they hang onto their residents and try to continue to serve their needs, even thru Hospice if needed.

It sure didn't compare "AT ALL" to what I saw outside of that setting, as a true "AL". That former AL that I saw, . yes there was very clear expectation that ADL's be performed alone by resident, and that resident appear, at least daily, dressed . and on their own, without prompt . .to the dining room for at least one meal of the 3 served. Failure to do so, .. and repeated need for prompt and/or assistance in that setting, would result in in a transition to a different setting where more help is available.

I've looked at every review I can find (just out of my own curiosity) as to WAF and all are good reviews .. I can't find anything, not on my own . in my rudimentary searching, . indicative of people less than pleased with WAF.

One would think, .. 'yea sure, they all say that . .that they hang onto their residents and treat them like family, yea sure .. til they get older and more frail . then they kick em on down the road'. That would be what one would think, . with an AL label. But from what I viewed there of the population on site ... they must not be lying .. as there were plenty that appeared to be of the more needy sect. One would think, .. 'yea they label themselves as AL . and as such, don't have to staff appropriately as a SNF might have to do, to meet the need of more compromised population'. Maybe that is the case, I don't know ... I didn't ask them "how many people do you employ here, vs how many residents you have".

You put the two together .. as in the one setting where it was truly in every sense of the word, .. a bonafide AL . and in that setting, clear expectations set forth as to what the resident should be capable of .. and clearly defined what would be the result if the resident is not capable. You see that setting . and you know .. if you place your LO there . and the need is greater than what they have outlined as their expectations . it'd be real easy for them to say .. "We are an AL .. we aren't staffed to meet that kind of need .. your LO needs a setting with more help than we can provide in an AL".

So you put that together, w/what's seen and touted by WAF .. and you wonder, .. they label themselves as AL .. is that what they'll pull too .. in the end? Oh your LO needs more help than we can provide, we are only an AL.
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(cont'd)

But by the looks of the population I viewed when I visited there, . they certainly didn't kick a good many on down the road . there were just as many old and frail and slumpers .. seemingly at WAF . as is the case at Purgatory ... and so ... maybe they are genuine in their tout of "we treat our residents like family and try to hang onto them as they grow more needy and frail, and not transition them on to another setting".

It's strange to me.

You almost want to smell a rat in the woodwork somehow .. how can they claim to be an AL .. and they certainly are more than that .. that's for sure.
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Dorker, to look at it the other way round, how often have we had cause to wonder what certain facilities consider "assisted" means? They provide accommodation with support services, okay; but the support is so freakin' limited you wonder how they justify the money they charge. It's actually quite refreshing that WAF believes in providing its residents with help according to what they need, as opposed to what they grudgingly offer.

If they do, of course. But why assume they don't, not really?
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According to WAF (which I think is a good thing . but whether it actually pans out, not my fish to fry).

There has been some discussion with them .. as to the shortfalls of MIL.

1. She doesn't consistently, if at all, .. use the call button.

2. Result of this is that she falls, has fallen 2 x's in the last few months.

The answer given by WAF staff member:

"Falls aren't very common here, . if we have a resident who is a fall risk .. we utilize bed/chair alarms . .and so .. while that won't keep them from getting up .. at least it sounds an alarm and we know to get there, the person is on the move".

Purgatory .. if that's even an option and it must be for those they deem it necessary for .. hasn't ever mentioned the use of same. It hasn't been asked of them, to my knowledge anyway.

Sounds like DH and SIL are being forthright .. at least on the MIL front and honest about what the scene is with her.

I do know that I heard SIL and DH talking and both agree . and they're right . their mom HATES/LOATHES/DESPISES with a white hot passion . bed/chair alarms. Having had those each time she's been hospitalized.

SIL said to DH: "Maybe it would retrain her that she HAS TO USE THE CALL BUTTON".

Of course, the pessimist in me that smells a rat where maybe there isn't one .. would have me thinking of the above in the context of: "they better have a LOT of staff to come running . because what I saw when I visited there . maybe they don't all try to get up like MIL does . but I sure saw some that .. if they tried to, they'd be in the damn floor .. they better have a LOT of staff to come running .. and Purgatory seems to have a lot of staff .. and so .. they don't seem to utilize chair/bed alarms there . not that I'm aware of .. why not?. Maybe Purgatory isn't staffed to the degree that someone can come running when an alarm sounds. Well WAF .. as an AL .. surely isn't either then".

In the end, it's not my wagon to pull .. if they move their mom there, eventually (none of it would transpire tomorrow) .. whether it works or doesn't . wouldn't be any onus on me to sort through.

I just hope the two of them .. and I already know MIL does .. aren't looking at WAF as the pie in the sky answer to it all.

Friendlier/more caring staff (as MIL would have you believe, staff at Purgatory are mean at worst, aloof and uncaring at best).

It is interesting though, what little I can vet of it all .. just looking around at reviews of WAF . online .. I don't find anyone complaining about the place. That is interesting. Maybe just maybe it is all they say it is.

The only reason she didn't land there straight from POSH is that they don't do Medicaid Pending . as does Purgatory. MIL had to go to a setting that allowed Medicaid Pending . as she awaited approval for Medicaid funding . and that has now been accomplished.
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Ah, yes, POSH! And I remember SIL was so wistful wishing that MIL could progress to Fancy Pants. Of course she knows that is out of the picture now. That was the place that expected everyone to be able to independently accomplish most of the ADLs, get themselves to meals at the proper time, etc.

Every state is different, but surely there are different licensing standards for ALs and SNFs. I've read articles to beware of the lack of standards for ALs.

So there will be a Medicaid bed available and waiting for MIL at WAF? The Medicaid beds aren't limited?

And, you know, even if MIL ever gets her field trip to WAF, are they going to be willing to wheel her in through a back door so that she doesn't see the slumpers? And, since it's smaller, WILL she be able to NOT see slumpers on her visit?
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Oh who knows when/if WAF has an available bed. We do know they accept Medicaid .. but how many of their beds are Medicaid, I don't know.

And as for whether they wheel her around and out of sight of the slumpers she so abhors .. I don't know that either. I just know that DH has expressed a want to be there when/if ever this transpires .. and I'm supposing he better make sure that's part of the whole tour there .. else-wise .. he will have a rude awakening when his mother lands there and begins the complaints about the "same slumpers are here".

That's the whole reasoning that SIL and DH both have, as to being absolutely staunchly in agreement they want her to "buy in" by going to visit herself ..

I think if ever there was a good plan that is one. They need to make sure that she's toured there, .. and "buys in" .. before any move.

I guess .. the inference there would be, when there is incessant complaint yet again, just a different setting now .. maybe one could say "well you came and saw the place yourself, and wanted to go there .. that's what you wanted .. ".
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Realistically--do you really think that the move to WAF will ever actually happen? I have little knowledge of the money end of NHs and such, how to go about getting approved, etc. It SOUNDS like MIL has still got a VERY LONG ways to where she is approved financially to enter WAF, and perhaps, they won't even take her.

Everyone is so worried about HER being happy there--what about her even QUALIFYING to live there? we have 3-4 WAF type homes in our community--one is truly an extension of someone's HOME.. an RN opened this and has employed family for years. Altho they tout themselves as being "senior friendly' their turnover rate for a year is pretty much 100%. I've never heard any complaints about the care there. The one nearest me has about 30 residents, it's 'nice' but so very, very depressing. I think too many residents per CG. A lot of people who live in the neighborhood use it, as they can be 'boots on the ground' as far as care....if you don't have someone outside looking out for you, I hear your care is pretty substandard. And yes, slumpers abound. A friend of mine had her FIL there and she said as long as she was very 'sneaky' about her visits-meaning she came at irregular times to keep the staff on their toes--she'd frequently find FIL still lying in bed at 9-10 am having had no breakfast brought to him, or laying in a filthy diaper. He got great care simply b/c the family each took one day to basically 'live' with him there.

MIL is not ready not capable of 'independent living' of any kind. I don't know why they dangle that in front of her. The financials aren't in place, she hasn't even SEEN it--and she cannot care for herself. Sounds like SIL and DH are set upon this place and can't see that it probably can't happen--for months yet.

Once again, everyone is so worried that MIL will be 'happy' and nobody is saying 'gee, is WAF a good fit for her and her for them?" It's NOT all about making her happy (and you can't anyways).

As far as the seemingly random forgetfulness: Nobody can tell you what a time ravaged brain is thinking. There's no reason for why MIL remembers somethings and constantly forgets others. There is no answer. I watch my mom as she becomes more 'ditzy' over time. It makes no sense at all, the stuff she zeroes in on. I have long since given up on trying to even talk to her. Some days I guess she's completely with the program and some days she's not oriented to space and time at all.

Probably something sparked MIL to remember it was Monday and that meant a hairdressers appt. Who knows? Just accept and be glad for what she does remember. Quit wondering WHY, just be glad that she has the occasional brain spark.

Personally, for all the hysterics over her dog...that seems to be a dead subject! That's good, b/c it seemed like she was going to harp on it forever.

Really, until SIL shows up again with her magic tricks, things just are going to be kinda flatlined. Too bad MIL has refused PT so much. But that's her right, Sadly, she won't have as many options when she wants to move--if she can't do certain ADL'S on her own, it will limit her chances of living where she 'wants'.

And it really is too bad she doesn't like TV. My mom has 3 in her tiny apartment and the are all on all day, everyday. She enjoys the oldies channels and the sports channels and she's more up on the news than I am.

I don't enjoy TV, never have. I am so picky about what I waste my time on. But with literally hundreds of channels nowadays--youd; think MIL could find SOMETHING to watch. My sweet dad was STILL watching PBS documentaries until he entered Hospice Care. He NEVER stopped learning.

Although, truly, his favorite thing in the world became watching "RoadRunner" cartoons with a grand kid on the bed next to him. Wow, he'd laugh so hard--I can't watch RR cartoons without crying. He had a sad, long 'dying process' but showed us how to do so with great dignity.
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Dorker, where are you reading reviews of the facility? TIA
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Dorker, I think you're overly suspicious/critical of WAF. You have been comparing it to rehab/nursing facilities like Purgatory; that's apples and oranges. In my experience, an ALF doesn't have onsite rehab facilities, it doesn't have on-site medical staff. At best, it has CNAs with some trained supervision, periodic visits from licensed medical personnel, and, if prescribed, rehab visits from outside home health agencies or hospice services. Also, in my experience, many facilities try to keep residents until the very end (like WAF) if at all possible. As long as the resident doesn't need *skilled* medical attention around the clock, and, if s/he has dementia, isn't violent, they'll do their best to meet their needs, perhaps with outside support from home health agencies, hospice, or providers hired by the family. Remember also that this isn't an endless commitment on the part of the ALF --- the life expectancy of an ALF resident is limited. Based on my experience with my parents, what I've read so far from you about WAF sounds absolutely normal and acceptable. The question is, what does it cost. Oddly enough, the two facilities in my area that resemble WAF the most are also the least expensive. First my father, and later my mother, was in one of them. Go figure.
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My mom experienced 3 different places. A "POSH", a SNF/rehab, and finally a WAF. POSH (actually an "independent living" place) drained her finances and then kicked her out, basically as she started losing her capacities. (that was when I moved her to my state with me, setting her up in a small, safe home of her own very near me, which was actually a workable arrangement for 3 or 4 years. During that time, she rather "regenerated" compared to how it was going at POSH) Her illusions of how great POSH would be did NOT materialize, as of course she hated it the whole time, and just isolated in her apt. totally. My mom was very much like MIL personality-wise.

The SNF/rehab was quite like you describe. Big, sterile, corporate type place. Needs were basically meant, but the place was not friendly or caring. They were efficient. Rehab was done, until those funds ran out, regardless of progress. Diapers were slapped on because basically it is easier. Mom quickly learned to just mess in the diaper. It WAS actually what they encouraged. No, calls were not responded to, med mistakes were made, mom was left sitting in the bathroom way beyond the safe time, calls to the front desk went unanswered. I didn't quite believe mom about these things either, but then I witnessed them all. The people there really did not care as I saw it., although I wanted to believe otherwise.

When mom wound up in WAF, it was such a relief. It also was billed as an AL, but the manager there assured me that they do all they can to keep them there through the whole end-of-life process. The aura of kindness and support, and understanding there was like day and night compared to SNF. All there were treated as individuals. Mom was on hospice there and died there, and it was gentle, loving and peaceful, even at the end. But it was not a fancy place. It was homey, and the clients there really did get a lot of individual friendly attention.

My take is that it is a corporate vs. old-fashioned small business type thing. Just like some people might prefer chain restaurants, while others like a small simple home cookin' restaurant.
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I want to say something about SNF/rehab facilities, which are getting a bad rap here. My experience consists of three weeks in a SNF/ rehab facility recovering from a major operation and a bad trip on anesthetics. I look at the stay in the rehab facility as an extension of my hospital stay, and judge the care I received accordingly. Briefly, I can't praise their care of me highly enough, especially considering that they were at the same time caring for people who were recovering from strokes, heart attacks, broken bones, car accidents, major surgery, amputations, etc. Sure, my bell went unanswered a couple of times; yes, a couple of non-critical issues were overlooked. But they got me back in shape and never neglected anything that was truly important. Just saying...
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IMO, the BEST possible recommendation you can ever get for a facility is that the person who is talking to you has their parent there. Of course, it matters whether THEIR parent and your parent have the same issues and level of functioning.

We moved mom into the AL where a cousin had three relatives. My mom needed less ADL care than provided and more "hand-holding" than was provided on site.

She ended up, eventually in an Independent Living Facility with geriatric psych support for anxiety.
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realtime - Your SNF/rehab experience matches the first SNF/rehab my mom went to after she broke her hip years earlier, at age 80, and also the rehab my DH was in after his AAA trauma. They were both really good and very beneficial for their healing. Even mom thought that place was great.

Maybe the difference lies in whether the placement is truly with the idea of rehab AND returning home to one's life, or the unspoken knowledge that the person will never actually rehab and is destined to remain in SNF care through til the end, with little hope of actual rehab.

My mom, like MIL played the game of walking up and down for 20 minutes or so, 3x a week, fully supported with the harness at the end-of-life SNF/rehab. But then back to bed it was, with the diapers and no further assistance to return to functionality of any sort. But at WAF, at least she had some further visiting rehab for a while that actually was beneficial, where she was taught transfer skills, how to safely sit down, arm strength exercises, and yes - even how to locate and push the call button which she finally did figure out! (much more realistic)
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I don't know if this is the case with others, but in the case here, you have to remember how many times MIL was hospitalized, and rehab the recommendation (and/or sometimes that all-important 3 day stay negated the ability to direct to rehab).

MIL essentially lived the life of a hermit .. isolated .. and not "exposed" to other settings and others with frailties and dealing with a setting with staff she found perhaps "less than friendly" or otherwise.

She was essentially a hermit .. happiest in her own home, always. And that went on for a long long time, .. and enabled .. true .. by SIL.

She would land in the hospital with some ailment . .and recommendation she now go to Rehab for a couple of weeks .. to build stamina/strength and SIL would always .. but always .. .hop on a plane and get here, to see to the discharge from hospital and MIL's disdain for being directed to rehab of any sort.

Had to have cost SIL a small fortune through the years, .. the hopping on a plane on a moment's notice . and off she'd come, in this direction, to see her mom thru post hospital follow up doc appts., tests . .and the home PT that would be assigned (only for MIL to dismiss home PT once SIL departed, routinely).

Driven by guilt on SIL's part, ,.. driven by an insatiable desire that her mom never have to be "unhappy" .. and that would certainly have made her "unhappy" .. and so for a long long time .. any hospitalization that others might've found themselves directed to a rehab stint .. and all that comes with it . .was not MIL's plight .. ever.

In fact one of those times, when I was in the throes of all things MIL . and bought in and not yet departed . .she was hospitalized . and refused rehab stint . . and so HHC folks assigned . as well as PT . and .. I didn't fight her, or the system . .I went with it ... discharge for home and it was me . that was on the front hauling her hither and yon . and being on site, to welcome PT and HHC . and assimilating her to that process and advocating for her, etc. Only for her to dismiss both of the above (routine for her) . whenever I finally got it to what I thought was "settled" enough and I in larger measure backed out of daily visits there.

She wasn't ever one to go to senior centers . even when her mobility was better than it has been in the last few years .. that wasn't her thing . "that's not me, that's not what I'm about, .. all those old people". She could never be persuaded to go and join any kind of social engagement of any sort, be that a neighborhood get together, .. a ladies church function . a senior center, etc.

She lived . very much . for a long long time .. and it was "enabled" . in large part, . the life of a hermit .. a recluse almost, isolated.

I'm sure to her, .. all of this .. "institutional" stuff . those kinds of settings . and the fact that old people just don't change gears . they just don't do that . aren't able to .. this whole awakening ... to the fact that this is now her life. It's a pill too big to swallow for her.

She always hated . hated hated .. to be hospitalized and would go down with a fight before she would even go to the doctor, or ER .. with the sure knowledge they'd want to stick her in the hospital. Some of those times, .. clear cut . she needs to be in the hospital . no qualms about it .. one of those .. a time SIL was fighting chitapalooza in her for weeks on end, . and it wouldn't abate . and docs wanted her hospitalized but SIL kept up the valiant fight at home .. . sans we displease MIL and her be unhappy. Until .. she finally had to cave in, it wasn't getting better, and MIL passed out .. in her bedroom, rescue 911 called. No choice at that point, hospitalization.

No one likes to find themselves inpatient at a hospital. None of us. But her complaints as to that setting were that she's just a victim . that they come to probe and poke . and at all hours of the day and night ..
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(cont'd)

(yep they do, .. all hours of the day and night, they do that).

That they have this damn alarm thing . if I so much as stick one foot out of the bed .. they come running, that damn alarm thing rings .. she H.A.T.E.D. that.

I think ultimately as time marched on . it also became a disdain for that setting in that .. one her age . and her frailties and so forth . it became more than she could even process .. "wait your'e taking me for what ..???...what test ..???... what's that for .. what will that tell us?".

It was more than she could work through and process . and so she felt as though she was just a victim of whatever assembly line system is in place . and she would go down fighting before she'd ever even agree to a doc visit ... with the sure knowledge that they'd want to stick her inpatient in a hospital.

And that worked, some of the time .. particularly when/if SIL could fly down here and run that hamster wheel in her mom's care.

So .. all of that to say .. she lived . for a long long time, pretty isolated from the world at large .. and having to engage and be in the presence of others' and their frailties ... as well as dealing with institutional settings and staff thereof and their various idiosyncrasies.

The very map of "how not to do things" IMO.

I don't know, in the end, . how do you "make" someone go engage in a senior center, and/or neighborhood activities if their proclivity is to not do so. I don't have the answer for that. I know it was tried. Not successfully. How do you "make" someone go to rehab as recommended, when their proclivity is to not want that as an option. Well for one, . you don't hop on a damn plane and spend countless hundreds of dollars "enabling" that as a set up.

In the end, what we have is someone here (this is an extreme exaggeration, but the jist is the same). Howard Hughes from way back when . a known recluse .. to the point of almost ill in the mind .. think of taking him out of his environment and sticking him in an institutional setting . and all that comes with it, and having to live among the commoners .. .and the staff .. as any other citizen might find themselves. It would've been a disaster.

That's about what has been viewed in all this. MIL .. awakened . and not adjusting at all, .. (not really) .. to a life that she never really had any exposure to.
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Dorker--

MIL KNEW what living in a facility would be like. That's why she fought y'all so much on it.

No doubt she had seen myriad friends and relations end up in either POSH or WAF or, sadly, places like she is now.

I know she's pretty clueless now, but trust me, she KNEW what could happen. She's a pretty good actress, I'll give her that. The tears and tantrums for the last 10+ years at anything that displeased her.

What is so sad is that she probably does not NOW have the ability to 'change' and she can't playact anymore. She can't keep the lines straight. It is just what it is. Sad? Yes, very, when it didn't HAVE to be this way.

MIL will always live on as a cautionary tale of what can happen when you refuse to plan. She always KNEW her kids didn't have the funds to keep her in 'style' and she refused to ever accept that she, too, would age.

Narcissism aside, she is/was spoiled to pieces by SIL and that has not been helpful at all in this rat chase of a life. SIL stirred the pot so much the soup was ruined.

It's sad, yes, but I hope you get to a place where this is not the only thing you can think/talk about.
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I've got all 3 g'kids this weekend, until Monday afternoon. So, I'm sure my behind will be dragging .. but with a smile on my face. They are a lot of joy. High energy, but a lot of joy.
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Mid; I'm going to kind of sort of disagree with you.

MIL did not know what a nice facility would be like. If she were wise, she would have sold her house and used the proceeds to get herself into a place that had different levels of care, and that accepted Medicaid when her private pay funding ran out. She would have done this when she was still mobile and compis mentis enough to benefit from all that a good facility offers. If I recall, Dorker's YD worked in such a place.

There ARE nice IL/AL facilities with good companionship. Yes, it is a big change to give up your possessions and go from wandering around a big house to living in a single room and bath. My ex-MIL is going through this right now; she is not a particularly materialistic person, but she is giving up the house she raised her children in; her grandmother's stemware, the lighting fixtures she and her husband picked out 50 years ago. It's hard.

What Dorker's MIL has done is the equivalent of having her family drive around the campground looking for the perfect spot. There ain't a whole lot of perfect after you reach age 80; those of us who have longevity genes need to be prepared for that.
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Midkid said:
"MIL will always live on as a cautionary tale of what can happen when you refuse to plan".

My non-planning parents just bought sister (multi disabilities) a 'dust buster' hand held vacuum. Mum is concerned about crumbs on floor. Sister has never cleaned her floor herself & cannot bend to reach floor (or feet). Last fall was getting milk out of fridge.

Plan for more care? Assisted living? Supervised meds? Hygienic toileting?

Nope. But a vac for the crumbs.

I have learnt so much from this thread - Huge pile of thanks!

Keep strong all.
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I actually didn't say "nice facility". All along the bump in the road was the LACK if any place 'nice enough' for her that didn't sicken SIL and, to a small degree, DH. I'm sure she saw plenty of sad places as her friends were moved to some of the less nice ones. But I'm not gonna fight you :) Maybe some nice ones, I don't recall, but the $$ aren't there to cover it anyway.

I know my mother now truly regrets living with my brother. But, poor planning and such have her in brother's home where she refers to my brother as her 'jailer' and his wife as her 'arch nemesis'.

If MIL were 'wise' we wouldn't have had such an amazing read for the past 2 years +.
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Mid, you and everyone else may recall that about 5000 posts ago, I suggested that MIL probably had some experience with an institutionalized friend or family member.

I'm pretty certain that she had/ has some picture in her head that frames all of her expectations and current experiences.

At some point in the past, getting a therapist involved might have been of value. Having a geriatric psych on board early in my mom's transition to IL certainly helped, both with anti anxiety meds and with re-framing my mother's expectations and experiences.

One small example. My mom claimed that "all the inmates are given the same haircut" ( by the easily accessible in-house beauty salon).
"So, F, how would you change that, how could you get a better haircut?"
"I could ask my daughter to take me once a month to the local salon".
Done. No whining, no drama. The geripsych helped my mom make sense of her new living situation, and prioritize her requests to us.
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BarbBrooklyn ... whether or not MIL had prior first-hand knowledge, she was *definitely* exposed to mid-20th Century pop-culture, which provided many a grim picture of conditions in "retirement" or nursing homes. (Which, to be fair, were, likely, mostly true at the time.)

And in pop-culture, "demented" meant wacko, and probably dangerous.

This might be one more reason why so many of us find our elders fighting tooth-&-nail to stay home, long after it's become impossible.
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Lol @ Barb..............5000 posts ago. LOL

Reminds me of one time my mom and I went to a local restaurant here in Vancouver. The menu was a zillion pages long. I said to my mom, this looks good. Mom "which one?" I said, turn to page 55.

Sorry, I know that was off topic. Just trying to inject some humor here.
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Lol Gershun!
As long as we're going off topic....

At the stage were talking about (shortly after mom moved into Independent Living and everything was a crisis) she starts out one of my weekly visits with "I have a terrible problem!"

The "terrible problem" was that she was needing to get up twice a night to pee! By this time, I had handed off solving all of moms issues to the geripsych and her new geriatrician. I said I had no good solution and she should talk to one of them.

Mom called later that week...problem solved.

Mom has seen the geripsych. Dr. D had asked her " Flo, tell me exactly what you do when you get up in the night to pee". My mother reported all of her ablutions ending with "and I drink a glass of water". She and the doctor burst out laughing simultaneously. No more glasses of water in the middle of the night. Problem solved.

The point is that my mother was an adult. Adults need to solve their own problems or reach out for help to do so. T'wasn't my job to solve all of mom's issues for her.
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Oh I sooo want a Geripsych on my Mum's team...

I am still reading this thread from beginning & at Aug 2018 when MIL was about to fly to IL.... just tuned in to the future by mistake & have no idea what's happening,., but... hope Docker has not sucumbed to stress related illness with her lot!
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Perhaps Dorker has doubts about WAF because.....

Over the past decade, 99.9% of SIL’s & DH’s “plans” for MIL are nothing but cockamamie-bullsh*t magical thinking.

Same goes for MIL’s “plans” for herself.

Dorker has made great progress with boundaries.

But all this “Oh, we found the answer to MIL’s problems. Again” is a big bushel of triggers.

The Emporer’s New Clothes.
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