I've posted before about in-law care-giving. Aged mother in law, lives in same town.
We are at the tail end of a visit from sister in law from several states away. Sister in law has been here for 3 weeks caring for her mother. A much welcome respite.
It had been discussed, prior to her arrival here on the scene, she would be talking it over with her mother, to try and get her mom to come up to her home, for a stay of maybe a few months.
This, in my opinion, is absolutely essential, as I am expecting twin grand-children, due in about 1 month (if they don't come sooner, as is the case a lot of times with multiples pregnancies). The expectant mother also lives locally here, and has a 4 year old daughter. I will be on that front, helping .. as much as is needed. And not on the front with mother in law and care-giving, and have made that as obvious and apparent as I know how to make it. It would be great if mother in law would agree to go to her daughter's home (several states away) for a period of a few months .. and allow me the latitude to put my energies where I want them to be, on my daughter who will have had a c-section .. and my grand-daughter (4 years old) and new twin babies.
Nothing doing. Mother in law has dug in her heels, and will not hear of it, going to stay with her daughter for any period of time.
What are her reasons?
In mother in law's defense ... her daughter ... I don't even know how to describe it. I will say that when her daughter comes here to visit, she all but breathes for her mother and if she could find a way to do that, she'd do that too. She is the most nervous nelly, never sit down - ever ... worry wart, do everything, all the time .. person that I've ever encountered.
A great example, as I was taking her to the airport yesterday for her departure, . I reached into the fridge to grab myself a bottled water and shut the fridge and turned to walk away, as I've done for all of my 50 plus years living on this earth .. and she said to me, "Oh make sure that fridge shut". WTH???? Like I don't know how to shut a fridge? That's just a small, very small slice of what she is ... how she is.
She is so very hyper-vigilant, seeing to every minute details down to it's finest most minuscule point, fine tooth comb, questioning every point along the way, "should we do thus and so, but maybe if we do thus and so, then such and such will happen, maybe we should do it thus and so .. but then so and so might happen, maybe we shouldn't do thus and so, but do "x" "y" and "z" instead, but if we don't do it that way then ..........", on and on and on and on it goes. And usually in hyper warp speed, as to every single friggin thing.
If her mother moans .. "what's wrong mother?, why did you moan, are you alright?".
Mother: "Yes, I'm fine, I was just sighing out loud".
Sister: "Why did you sigh? Are you hurting, are you sure you're alright, why are you sighing what's the matter?"
Mother: "For God's sake __________________, I was just sighing, .. calm down, I'm fine".
Sister: "Are you sure, .. because if something is wrong you need to tell me".
Mother: "Everything is fine, I'm fine".
Sister: "Are you sure, we did a lot yesterday, did we do too much, maybe we shouldn't of gone to two doctors in one day .. was that too much for you, are you too tired now, maybe we need to move those other doctor appointments so we won't have two in one day, is that too much for you, for one day .. is that why you were sighing .. what's wrong, are you sure you're alright".
Hopefully that kinda gives a little bit of a snapshot of what goes on when sister is in the ring directing things.
So in mother in law's defense.. I do get it, why she wouldn't be chomping at the bit to go to her daughter's home.
BUT ....
The only experience she has with her daughter, in the last years as mother in law has aged and been unable to go anywhere much, has been the daughter coming here, periodically, for periods of about 3 weeks at a stretch. When her daughter comes here, she moves heaven and earth for her mother and then some, and doesn't sit down, doesn't stop .. the WHOLE ENTIRE TIME.
Is there a possibility maybe (as I said to mother in law, when she expressed that isn't happening - talking to me - her going to her daughters .. ever) .. could it be possible that maybe if you would go to where she lives .. she'd be more busy managing her own life in that setting than your's and she would get out of your backside .. and not be as hyper-drive-vigilant as you experience in her, when she's here, could that be possible.
The daughter is retired, lives several states away. Does come here, generally, every few months .. and stays for a period of about 3 weeks at a stretch. I wish I could make a list of everything the daughter did when here this last time, but it would take up the whole character allotment:
SIL: "well I got her this neat grabber thing . so she can get her clothing out of the closet, ya know they hang up everything here, they don't fold it and put it in drawers .. and .. she can't *stand* to do that .. so I got her this grabber thing . but ya know (put this in italics for attention, this next part, from her mouth) .. but ya know, I went ahead and folded it all and put it in drawers .. I know .. complicit in her dressing herself without assistance, counter to what you guys want .. but .. ya know .. she is just so fiercely independent and won't ask for help .. I know putting the stuff in her drawers more enables that she go about that, without help .. and that's counter to what you guys want ...".
Her words, out of her mouth.
My point in drawing that out as explanation is this. SIL .. for whatever her reason(s) basis . is not seeing the "whole" picture and buying into what it means. I don't know why .. I can't explain it. But .. seeing all this go on ... I mean .. you go buy her slip on shoes .. that you know dam well before you even arrive there w/them .. she is struggling to even loosen shoestrings on the sneakers she does have ... and get her foot in the shoe .. but somehow she's gonna be able to manage slip ons??!?!?!??? Really?
The same reason she turns to her mom . with a "Why don't you put lotions on mom?". It doesn't compute even with SIL that her mom ... I don't know how to articulate it . but that's about like me asking one of my 2 yo g'kids .. "why don't you eat your peas". I'm not likely gonna get any answer that makes any sense .. it just "IS" what it is .. she doesn't put lotion on .. because .. yes she has dry breaking skin . but that quotient .. problem=equals find a solution . is lost on her capabilities anymore. BUT SIL .. asks of her mom . why aren't you doing thus and so.
SIL .. who .. sat right there in that meeting as MIL was chided for dressing herself .. for toileting herself (her complaint is that they don't come .. not quick enough . up for debate what *quick* means here, . with someone with no time management capability) .... and so she does it herself ... up for debate whether she actually even calls them at all . .they say she does not . she says she does ... and SIL . ... who should be on the page of getting dialed in on that as issue .. what's the source of the issue here and how to we get to the optimal end result . she says she calls you guys . you say she doesn't . in the end, what she is doing is putting herself at risk here .. by toileting and dressing herself without assistance .. and you guys chiding her for that .. we have someone here w/Moderate Dementia as a dx .. let's assume she's not going to call for help and we know that, so what's our next step to get that addressed.
No, what she does is put her clothing (and chides DH for not doing so) into her drawers . making it that much easier for her to "dress herself" .. without assistance .. clothing more accessible than hanging in a closet where she might have to call for help .. gets her a grabber she thinks she can actually use . will remember to use .. gets her a shoe horn .. that she thinks will help her put shoes on (it doesn't help, not a bit) ...
Folks, w/her it's always the next bell and whistle .. and that'll solve it, always is, always has been.
Back when I used to holler from every roof top this is getting to be too much to manage .. and the answer was always one more gadget, thingamabob . and so on, that hasn't changed.
Remember the story from way back . .SIL in town .. the PT guy coming .. and he mentioned she needs a stationary bike . and so they set about to find one on Craigslist . found a splendid one . needed DH pulling off jobsite to go secure this stationary bike
NURSING STAFF, PLEASE......
1. Get her up, washed and dressed Every Morning.
2. Put Lotion/Cream on her skin Every day to prevent cracks and infection.
3. Promote Activities to enhance her involvement & enjoyment.
4. Encourage her to go to dining room to eat her meals.
5. Showers every Wednesday and Saturday
And any other thing you can think of to get her the standard of care she deserves? The white board may help to remind Mother, but should be directed to the Nursing Staff, as things that are Expected to be done to support her with her living environment.
I understand that this may not solve all of her issues, but it might help!
I agree, the Nursing home is dropping the ball on many normal standard of care issues that should be being done on the daily. I feel sorry for the old gal.
DH and I both arguing that point, . she can't even remain upright and balance, she doesn't NEED a stationary bike.
To the argument from SIL: Oh he says he'll help her to learn to use it safely .. he won't let her use it if he isn't here, and by the time she's not receiving his services, he will have taught her how to mount it and dismount it safely . and not fall.
To our argument: "That is a bunch of b'chit SIL . she can't even stay upright .. she has no biz being on an exercise bike . if he wants her to strengthen her legs .. then maybe one of those that you use from the comfort of your seat . not having to mount/dismount a stationary bike . no .. that's just stupid.
In the end, .. DH off the jobsite, and off he and I go to get this bike.
It still sits .. here we are 3 or 4 years later, in the room it was left in . and as soon as SIL departed for home, PT guy was dismissed (as was always the case with in home PT) .. and the bike never saw the light of day again .. as to any use.
Now that too will need to be disposed of.
Remember the story of when her dog was so sick with diahrea . and me having to insert my help into that scene and imploring MIL to leave the dog outside more in day hours . where he can do his mess and no messed up carpets and such . and no . no of course not . that would be like asking her to leave a child outside, . .how could I even ask that, she wouldn't hear of it.
Me telling SIL . and her then saying . "well can you take the child gate from your house .. over there and just lean it up on some chairs, maybe that'll keep the dog cordoned off to the tiled area and off the carpet".
Me explaining to her that the child gate .. stretched to it's widest width . would not suffice to cover the space in question . and so the dog can walk right around it and go wherever he wants . and her arguing that .. in her world, when she keeps her daughter's dogs . she doesn't attach the child gate at all, just leans it up on the door frame and the dogs stay where they should .. they don't go around it . and me countering that with . "your mom is a fall risk SIL .. if you go and put an obstacle in her way that she now has to move to get around . she is at greater risk of falling . she needs to put the dog outside more . so she's not having to try to bend over and clean up dog squirt off the carpet .. "
SIL persisting, wanting me to haul the child gate there, til I finally told her I don't want to hear another word about the child gate, not doing it . dont' want to talk about it another minute . done.
Always one more gadget .. no let's don't look at the reality of the situation let's find one more gadget and bell and whistle . that'll solve it, always.
Or the doggie diapers . when the diahrea was at issue . and me arguing she doesn't have the hand dexterity to deal with doggie diapers .. and the clean up that will ensue ...
Always one more gadget .. always.
Same thing persists.
As to why the facility/site itself doesn't adequately address .. "your mom has Moderate Dementia, let's talk to you about what that looks like in real time and expectations thereof, and what you can expect as to her capabilities . .and what we can do to meet some of that".
Why that isn't occurring .. I can't answer.
As to the toileting without assistance, and the whole piece of her claim she does call they don't come soon enough . .or whether as they say she doesn't call . they also are quick to point out she is on a 2 hour rotation . .they come and ask her if she needs assistance, . and she denies needing assistance (moderate Dementia ya think?) . and then the need for toileting pops up and she just does it .. on her own (moderate dementia maybe?) ..
Do they come daily to help her dress in the AM. I don't know .. but I'm willing to bet if they do, they either find her already dressed .. having struggled through that on her own . or she declines "need" for help and off staff member goes onto the next chore.
In my Moms situation having things hung high in a closet kept her from attempting to dress herself...most of the time. Her shoes had to be kept on the shelf above the hanging clothes or she would be out of the wheelchair head first into the bottom of the closet trying to get her shoes.
Again, SILs reasoning, insisting PJs being folded in sets and placed in a drawer? Why? They don’t need to be within MILs reach, she can’t dress herself and doesn’t need to be attempting to do so. I don’t get SILs problem with where the clothes are.
I certainly agree the NH staff should have been aware of MILs Edema and her skin so dry to the point of cracking and bleeding. The medical things are the important issues.
I did not mean to be snarky earlier. Of course anything MIL can do for herself should be encouraged. I’m just wondering if she’s to the point in her Dementia that she can realize geez I need lotion on my legs and think the process through.
My Maternal Grandmother who had no cognitive issues was always a part of her Care Plan Meeting. An active participant.
Mom on the other hand with Moderate Dementia did not participate in her Care Plan Meeting. Not my choice. That’s the way the NH conducted the meeting. Beside the fact she would have argued every point brought up I think I would have felt uncomfortable talking about some of the things discussed like she wasn’t there. She was there physically. But she would not have grasped what was being discussed. Weird and uncomfortable for me I think.
MIL saying herself, and proud of it (and yes under normal circumstances that is a great attribute) .. MIL's words: "You know, I just am not going to be one of those people that whines and carries on for every little thing .. I'm going to do for myself if I can .. I'm going to do everything in my power, to do for myself .. if I can do it".
MIL said those words, . in the Care Plan Meeting . and she is v.e.r.y. much . always has been .. look back upon the time when I kept trying to enlist that we engage others into the scene and her stance, "now I know what I must do here, and I will do it" .. (even though she was woefully inadequate at doing so) ... she will proudly . it's in every thread of her fiber . announce that she will do for herself .. with every ounce of her being .. that which she can struggle through and do.
It's her, thru and thru.
And so some of this falls in that line of thinking .. It is a wonderful characteristic to have in most people ... as opposed to someone who whines and moans for every little thing ..
And so some of this . is SIL in line with her mom's thinking . and not wanting to undercut her mom's willingness to "do for herself" that which she will struggle and try to do.
I think you'd play h377 getting the mom convinced .. in fact, probably not possible to convince her, "now mother, . there are things you just are not safe to continue to attempt and so we want you to stop doing on your own now . and ask for help".
I don't even think that would compute with any clarity in MIL's psyche ..
You answered most of my questions and elaborated before I was finished typing I guess.
Is it me or does SIL seem fixated on all the wrong things? Or too many of the wrong things.
She is also at the same time, . .not of any mental capacity to have any realization that maybe she SHOULD NOT DO SO ............ it's not safe.
Until she gets so far along in her journey that it's no longer possible to even try .. I suspect .. SIL will buy bells and whistles and spin tops . .to enable that attempt on her mom's behalf . and her mom will struggle along .. and it is a struggle, a mighty one .. to "do for herself".
I'm not sure what a NH does with that kinda patient.
You have patient example A that hollers and whines and moans .. .about every little thing . wanting someone to deal with it, whatever "it" is.
And you have patient example B .. who wants to "do for themselves" .. even though that patient is putting themselves at greater risk .. to do it.
What does a NH do?
In MIL's case, they'd have to give her one on one staff ... around the clock . to circumvent her efforts at "doing for herself". And that's not possible.
How does a NH get that across to a patient .. "yes Ms. so and so . that's wonderful you want to do for yourself .. but we don't want you doing that . and so we want you to call for help ..".
Then, we're right back at square one.
She says she calls for help . they don't come.
They say she doesn't call for help.
They say they have her on a 2 hour rotation to check on her, ... as to toileting or assistance . and she declines need for help.
She isn't "aware" enough .. that the 2 hour check rolls around and her think .. oh gee, . they won't be back for a while, let me see if I can toilet, while they're here to help me.
She is too far gone to have that awareness.
She declines any help offered.
So the staff person "insist" ..??.... "no Ms. So and So .. I'm here now . you must, let's get you on the toilet, whether you have to go or not". I don't see them taking that extra step .. they are too overworked, .. too easy to just say .. "okay, you don't need us, .. see ya later" and off they go, all too happy no help was needed and onto the next task.
So they show up first thing in the AM .. "ok, Ms. So and So, time to get you dressed".
They probably hear from her (I'm guessing) .. "oh I'll do that later, .. I haven't even eaten my b'fast yet, or brushed my teeth . .. let me eat some b'fast .. and we'll worry with that later".
Off goes the staff member.
That's why I say, I'm not sure what NH's do with someone of this ilk .. determined she will do for herself, even though it's a mighty .. horrendous struggle .. and dangerous .. and yet .. somewhat able to struggle through it, by her own choice .. but yet . not so incapacitated at this point . that she cannot even attempt any struggle to try, juxtaposed against any reality based vision on her part, of what she SHOULD and SHOULD not be doing.
I don’t know why, but the constant insisting that MILs clothes gets paired and folded - then lovingly placed into drawers really sends a bug up my backside.
Think about it. The time it takes to neatly fold a long-sleeved top verses putting it on a hanger. Okay. This could just be me. I admit - from several years of working for clothing retailers, I’m a pretty anal folder - but still... I mean, I was excited when I found my mom in clothes that matched and actually belonged to her. And, she was at a fancy, “boutique”, private pay only nursing home! When I visited my mom and I found her closet not to my standard - I redid it myself while she and I talked. I would have never asked the staff to bring out a folding template and take the time - which would be much better spent interacting with residents instead of their clothing - and to fold and/or hang garments to what I wanted as the standard.
No. SIL reminds me of one of THOSE mothers... you surly know what I mean if you’ve ever known one. The mother that thinks their little demon is a special little darling - one who does no wrong and is more intelligent and more talented than any of the other kids in the room - and therefore is deserving - entitled no less - to special treatment.
SIL, as well - seems to have a huge problem in dealing with reality. The “mild cognitive impairment” verses “moderate dementia”. Which, by the way Dorker - a few posts back you were back to calling it “cognitive impairment”... you need to banish that term from your vocabulary - it will help EVERYONE in MILs orbit if you’d call it what it is: DEMENTIA. I promise - it’s kinda like saying “vagina” out loud. At first it’s uncomfortable but the more you do it the easier it gets!
But back to the Reality point... The grabber is another example. SIL seems to think that with a little practice MIL will get better with it. She won’t. They - the elderly with DEMENTIA - don’t get better at anything - ever. It is a tragic one-way slide downwards in every capacity. Period. And no, Dorker - I’m sorry to be blunt here - but speech therapy isn’t going to do a single dam thing to improve MILs memory. AND, a book club? Even if you could find two other willing residents capable of reading, retaining and later discussing a book - which I doubt - it won’t last. Probably the reason the facility doesn’t do it anymore.
Dementia is a loosing battle. Sometimes little by little, day by day and sometimes marked deterioration followed by plateau and then marked deterioration...
Grabbers and matching pajama sets aren’t going to change that and trips off into the woods to kill Bambi isn’t going to make it go away.
No. I’m afraid with this crew it’s gonna be this way until the bitter end. At which time they will be struggling still - full of guilt and regret - that in the end they just couldn’t find the perfect campsite.
All about fall minimising - but never going to be 100% safe.
By getting resident out of bed before they attempt it solo. Regular toileting schedule, activities (if they don't say no) & lots of time in lounge with tv (supervised). Harder if they insist on belong alone in their room! Regular checks I think.
In my opinion dementia + unsteady walking = falls.
Balance gets worse = more falls. Brain gets worse (ALZ/vascular problems etc) = more falls. Falls cause injury/pain/stiffness = more falls.
Eventually frequent fallers may become bedridden & then become safer in bed (lowered to floor).
What an awful Debbie Downer I am...
Who wants to get old????
They're doing something right, maybe not everything, but something is causing her to be generally speaking, better health-wise than she's been in a long long time.
They don't come quick enough (that's a relative term though, we're talking about someone w/no time management skills, at all . .what to us is a wait of maybe 10 mins .. if that long, to her . .she'd describe it as "forever" .. ). I don't think, she even rings the staff ... they confirm that notion.
As to SIL, not making excuses for her, but rather to try to explain what you'd see if you were a fly on the wall to all of this show. She does A LOT that is just busy-ness . .and making work for herself unnecessarily and those in the field or range of all this .. if they'll heed her directives. Think a grabber device she might as well throw in the trash .. MIL won't have the motor skills to use it, nor remember it's purpose, .. a shoe horn, she might as well have saved her time .. she can't use that either, . hand dexterity/motor skills lacking, useless to her.
She does a LOT that is . making work for herself where maybe if she'd think clearer . or listen to the voice of nanny negative over here, .. she'd come to the conclusion before expending energies and monies for same . .and not do so.
But what you'd see in any visit with SIL . to her mom . she is busy . always always busy . always .. folding pj's to reorganize .. organizing books MIL has landed upon .. into some kinda order, .. going thru and organizing and neatly placing . in some order, drawers of things, .. tasking staff with what she sees as the next need/want .. hauling MIL out for a visit outside, small talking with those along the way, helping her mom to brush her teeth, wash her face, . you name it .. change clothes, put shoes on .. take shoes off, . you name it, always always busy. That's what you'd witness.
As opposed to her brother, who could care less if MIL's pj's are organized and her drawers .. and her books, .. and doesn't attempt any of that .. he just visits. Unless I'm there, . in which case, he zones out on what's on tv, and in a sense turns the floor over to me, if I'll take it. He will take her outside, to visit .. he will assist, if she asks .. "I need to go brush my teeth, will you help me to get over to the bathroom and hand me my toothbrush from that nightstand", but he doesn't take the initiative as his sister does . and prompt any of that, has to be asked, and will oblige . if asked .. but she is busy busy busy, always busy .. making work for herself .. always.
It all makes me nuts to be around it much, . truly does. Drives me up a tree.
The shoes . the shoe horn .. the grabber apparatus thing ... just the most recent of all the whirligigs .. but there have been many thru the years .. and I somehow have the distance enough from it all, to have the realization . before going to the trouble to secure the next whirligig . that the purpose of whatever that whirligig is . will be lost on MIL .. for motor skill reasons, memory reasons . whatever .. save your time SIL.
She does have some sense of it all, the capabilities or lack thereof. For instance, she did get back over there today to try on . on her mom .. the new slacks purchased, new pj's .. etc. Said her mom said to her, .. "why don't you just come get me, and we'll go to the store".
Said she explained to her mom ... but probably shouldn't have . should've just left it at "yea we'll do that" .. w/no intention of doing so .. she explained to her mom . "Mom that's not gonna be a good idea, you see here . you can stand .. and hold
you can stand, and hold on . and I can help you and the bed is right there . in case you can't stand any longer . you won't have that in a dressing room, and I can't even get you in the car to go".
So she does have some sense of it all, and doesn't fall into .. the fallacy that is doable.
Said she'd brought her mom a little tin bucket of teacup roses at the grocery store, and hadn't noticed that they weren't looking as chipper as maybe she'd hoped so she was taking them back home .. and her mom said to her, "now don't throw those away . go plant them in the yard". Said she just agreed with her mom (no intent to do that) . "yea, I'll do that". Has no intention, said she pitched in the trash on the way out the door of Purgatory.
SIL does indeed have some realization of her mom's limits .. and ... her mom wanting her to plant that little tin bucket of teacup roses . in a yard that will someday soon belong to someone else entirely when the home is gone . and no . not gonna do that. But her mom no real cognition of that fact.
I don't ever see a world where SIL goes there, without bells and whistles and whirligigs that somehow right her mom's world for her, in SIL's view .. and she just visits .. I don't see that will ever happen. She is gonna be busy busy busy .. til the day her mom passes .. trying to right the course of her mom's universe with the latest whirligig . to right it all.
Diagnostic goalposts appear to have moved. When I first heard of MCI several years ago, it was a matter of "Mild" meaning you lose the car keys more often than you used to, while "Moderate" meant you were making a few more mistakes at work ... juuust enough to require measures like more to-do lists, etc..
Depending on circumstances, MCI might - or might not - lead to dementia.
My FIL was re-assessed this week. He was "diagnosed" with Moderate CI. He constantly misinterprets new info, has serious memory issues, displays poor judgment (to the point where he can no longer drive), can no longer do simple arithmetic, and can only rarely follow conversations. MCI = BS.
It’s similar to “Developmentally Delayed” - as if the individual will catch up. It has all the impact as suggesting one is late for cocktails before dinner - in my opinion.
In my opinion, as well - soft selling serious conditions isn’t doing the effected person any favors. Serious conditions need to be address with serious solutions. It’s not the time for fluff.
I agree. People don’t speak in ‘plain english’ anymore. Everyone is so afraid of offending others. We should be polite but sometimes it does become ridiculous. I agree that things get ‘dumbed down’ at times.
English is a living language. What do you think our ancestors would think if they heard some of our expressions today? They wouldn’t know what the heck we were talking about! 😄
This because at the Care Plan Meeting, MIL herself had said to the staff attending there .. her words: "You know, I really like the people here, it's good". Those were "her words" she spoke.
Some of that .. I think .. is just MIL being nicey nice . and .. the former self of .. deeply ingrained knowing one has to . be agreeable and say what is expected of them .. even bleeding thru Dementia .. I truly do see it that way.
Why would she say that . when all she's expressed to DH and to SIL . thru the months is that she has to get out of there, don't leave me here to die .. don't let me languish in this horrible place and die here .. like there's some other setting she will find to be a Utopia ... she won't.
Probably all SNF .. all of them .. even for those that are private pay and loaded with $$$ to pay for it . is gonna be less than a desirable setting, even the best of them .. but she isn't loaded with $$$ to pay for it, and is relegated to a facility that is Medicaid .. and so .. even comparatively speaking .. if one could look at a site where it's all private pay residents there, . one would still find in it, . that it's not a pleasing place to view. But Medicaid is gonna be less than that even.
In a perfect world ... people who have loads of endless dollars to throw at aged care, . stay in their own home ... as long as is humanly possible, with around the clock c'givers .. and so .. don't have to have that exposure to dreadful SNF's.
That isn't MIL's circumstance . of course, and she couldn't be in her home . w/around the clock c'givers . none of us have the dollars it takes to throw at that.
So . she's had to go to a SNF . and a Medicaid one at that. Even if she had the dollars to go to the finest of fine .. for a SNF . it too would probably be a dreadful place. So . her whole .. her remarks over the last several months .. "don't leave me here to die, this can't be where I spend my last days . in this dreadful place, .. " and all she's had to say negative about it, all thru the months this has gone on .. even if one carted her to another Medicaid facility .. which is the only option we have . or for that matter, to the finest of fines .. as to a SNF . it would still not meet the standard that she thinks exists out there . and that I know . like I know my name . so I think that too is a bunch of whirligig spinning . to even entertain any notion of moving her, those are my thoughts, the negative nanny of the bunch that doesn't subscribe to all the rabbit holes and whirligig spinning ... that others seem to.
W/MIL having said those words the other day in the meeting ...
After that SIL and myself . had gone to a late lunch out . and while there, I noted to SIL she'd said those words, "I was surprised to hear her say that .. that she likes the people there .. and it's good, I was shocked to hear her say that ... ".
SIL: I know, I was too .. ya know ... I don't know that we'll go and try to look at another place .. I mean it would almost have to be something really really egregious for us to uproot her ..
SIGH
Same dam thing I'd said when it was getting tossed about a week or so ago . as to going to look at site B .. as a move. Same dam thing. My words at that time: "Oh man the upheaval of that .. I mean . new site/facility, new staff, all new people .. oh man . that's not gonna be good .. I don't know .. I just think .. in order to find that she needs to be moved .. it almost . to me . needs to be something really really bad that is cause for that .. the upheaval this is all gonna create".
At that time to her answer of: "Well she just seems so unhappy there .. says the staff .. don't care . don't come .. the slumpers .. I mean there are gonna be slumpers everywhere . so you can't avoid that . I dunno .. maybe if she goes and sees another site and sees it's no better .. maybe that'll put that to rest".
that, all a conversation that took place a week or so ago . and of course, as we all know, I stand down now .. I don't get in the middle as I once did and act as coordinator of all things . MIL and her happiness at the directive of SIL . I just don't, not anymore.
I don't concur with doing that, .. I don't find in it that it will somehow be the Utopia that it was seeming they were looking for, I don't at all, . and in fact, I happen to think the upheaval it will bring about, will be most unsettling and upending progress made as to the whole scene of not being able to live alone at home anymore, will bring that all full circle in all the adjustment to a new place .. but I stand down .. and don't get in the middle to get everyone on the page of yes let's get this done . now you go here, at "x" time and I'll go "z" at time . and we'll meet up and we'll make this happen. I don't do that anymore.
It's really kinda telling to me, what does not transpire .. in the absence of my hands all in it ..
SIL to .. within a week or so of all that dialogue .. to have come full circle to .. "I don't think we'll even bother with going to another site .... ".
Gee, .. finally a glimmer of "reason" in all this . whodathunkit.
From over here where I sit with it all .. outside . objective view .. it could still rear it's ugly head again . for all I know today . she'd call and say she's trying to get that on the radar again .. and I'd just smile and nod . and back off.
Among the many things that haven't transpired absent my hand in it all, .. I mean at one time DD and DH had it that they were gonna cart MIL over here for a cookout .. I thought they have rocks for brains and said so . but stood down. Hasn't happened has it?
More recently MIL laments that OD never comes to see her, and as I've mentioned here, there is a reason for that. OD's mental health hangs in the balance a lot herself .. and . to go there and listen . for OD . to MIL's laments about how to end her own life . MIL thinking OD a source for that as conversation . a person who has struggled with that very concept .. for decades .. and for her to have to hear that from her g'ma .. and ... really no way to help her g'ma process that . and not real skilled at shutting it down . is not good . and so OD .. has opted to just stay away ..
This is most upsetting to MIL . that OD doesn't call, doesn't come by . ever. Of course, with MIL's mental state .. compromised, Dementia . one can't say to MIl and expect that she would absorb and process it, .. "you ole bat . she doesn't come by because you think she's a source for conversation about how to end's one's own life .. that's too upsetting to her to have to process .. so just stop it".
So .... I had .. at one time, when that was on the radar . and MIL lamenting that OD never comes to see her . I had asked of OD . and of her dad .. maybe at some point, you go get OD and take her with you to visit . and if that becomes a topic . you divert and change the subject, make it a brief visit. DH liked that, to satisfy his mom's whim to see and visit OD . and OD liked that .. as an option ...
Has it happened?
Nope. It doesn't have my hand in it .. "OD what are you doing this Saturday .. I'd like to get it coordinated that your dad come get you . for a visit to MIL".......... "DH what are you doing Saturday that might be a good day for you to go get OD and haul her with ya to visit MIL".
I haven't gotten my hands in it all.
I put that out there, both were agreeable that might be a better option, but neither have taken the initiative to make it happen
And MIL . so I hear . is once again on that page .. "why don't I ever see OD . she never comes, never calls". I hear that chatter going on .. and I just stay out of it, .. reminding .. "well . ya know . at one time . we talked about . that it would be good if DH would go pick up OD and visit that way . ya'll need to make it happen".
But it doesn't happen.
N.e.v.e.r. ever again will I get more vested in the goings on than that of her next of kin .. n.e.v.e.r.
If they think it a good plan that she go visit Site B .. as an option to be moved .. I think it's a really really really bad idea to even entertain that as an option .. and I said so .. but have at it, if that's what ya'll think needs to take place .. let me know how it goes. Out of it. My hands not in it, making it happen.
If it's lamented that OD doesn't come .. and that somehow brings sadness to MIL .. I've made a suggestion . make it happen .. don't wanna .. oh well ... n.e.v.e.r. again .. will my hand be in it all, to coordinate and make it happen . whatever "it" is.
Same with the house that is being taken apart at present by SIL. SIL there, going thru drawers and file cabinets and books . and knick knacks and clothes . and so forth and disposing left and right (working like a dog) ... if DH doesn't find it that he needs to be there helping . neither will I.
Beside the point, but I have a really nasty cold at present and don't need to be around anyone spreading germs . and so .. that gives me a bonafide, legitimate excuse to not be there .. but I don't need one ... if DH isn't gonna make it happen that his sister have some help and she isn't gonna prod him (seemingly she isn't gonna) .. then why am I gonna throw my hands and back into it all, I'm not.
If DH and DD think it a good idea MIL be carted here for a bque .. I think that's a bad idea and said so . but have at it, make it happen ......
If they think it's a good/quaint idea that MIL be carted to her favorite restaurant of days gone by . even though the facilities there not suitable to meet her ADA needs .. have at it ... go for it ... let me know how that works out, won't be there.
Doesn't happen does it?
The negative nelly (realist) of the bunch .. surrounded by all these people with pie in the sky visions of what they "wish" could be .. and no realistic view of what "is" .. have at it . make it happen. I stand down.
Bring her here for a bque .. what the h377?
I mean .. c'mon .. to get into the bathroom where she'd need to go .. there are no grab bars .. there isn't a toilet apparatus on it, to lift it .. and there is no way to wheel a wheelchair up to the toilet, it won't fit thru the door . she's gonna hold on how? To get from the entry way . .of the bathroom .. thru the length of the bathroom over to the toilet . that gets done how?
These people don't THINK ..................... they just have this "vision" of the quaint . what they'd like .. for her to get to experience. I see that too, yes, it would be sweet and she'd enjoy it .. until she has to be carted up the 3 steps it takes to get into our house .. or wheeled around like a 4 wheel drive, . thru our side of our house . and to the back of the house and then lifted to get up the one step it would take outside, in the b'yard . and onto the screen room .. and then .. in the screen room now . but how to get in the house . which is gonna be another step up . to even get into the house .. I don't have wheelchair ramps here . so ya gonna lift her . what? And now she has to go to the bathroom .. DH ya gonna pick up all 150 lbs of her and carry her into the bathroom to set her on a toilet that has zero as to ADA accommodation .. ??.....
It's enough to make you scream . do you people just have empty space between your ears .. cuz I don't see any gray matter there at all.
THINK people!
But I get tagged as the negative nanny of it all.
So ya want her to go view site B, and you people somehow think she's gonna find in that, "ahh now this is nice, I'm comfortable here". WTH? That isn't gonna happen, what you're gonna do in the end is uproot any progress made . by putting her in an all new setting, new staff, new residents .. and all the upheaval for what, it'll just be more of the same .. that Utopia isn't there. But have at it. That's gotten dropped, for now
WHY do we insist that it's one way when it suits us and another when it doesn't??
My Mother has mild cog impairment--when it's convenient for brother to tell her she can't have/do something. When we see obvious failings, he says she's FINE and why are you bothering them? I finally told him, about a year ago, he cannot have it both ways: either mother can handle her own daily living duties and remember to whom she just talked --or how to dial her da7m phone by herself...then I would accept the dx of 'being fine' and not wonder if she's handing out thousands of dollars to scammers.
I have not seen her for 7 months and I have no plans to see her in the future. She'll get a gift in the mail, I am not going to her apt for anything Christmassy. She knows I have cancer and she called me ONCE and thought I was my sister. So--that hardly counts.
So I don't know---is she 'batshit crazy' as brother says or is she 'faking it' as he also says or is she really OK? He will not talk to any of us.
People can pass those cog evals if they're having a good day. My mom can play you if you are only there for 15 minutes. Past that, she's clueless.
Poor MIL--all the crap you've gotten for her over the years that were going to restore her health. Now it's going out on the street or to Goodwill. As far as those grabby sticks---my DH has 3. One is under the bed, one is behind the dryer and one is hanging in some closet. They're great until they aren't--really they are not strong enough to do anything very helpful, and if you lose your grip--the item you just snagged just falls off and you still have a problem.
I like the white board with basics for the NH staff. As much as they get maligned here, we have to remember, they are making barely above minimum wage. They get pooped on, slapped. yelled at and complained about---how long would you maintain a 'happy Hannah' attitude in that environment?
Let DH organize and put on a BBQ. And you stay quarantined in your bedroom. I did that one Thanksgiving--was SOOOOOOO sick and knew I couldn't pull it together, but DH insisted. I did cook it all and went to bed. Locked the door and out in ear plugs. Dh still refers to that as the "thanksgiving when B decided to be a brat'. Well, I had the FLU and nobody was real happy to even be here.
Is SIL coming back post holidays to finish the job? I don't know how RM's work but if it's like a foreclosure, there's not a lotta 'love' involved. Mostly shovels and dumpsters.
Take care, Dorker. You don't deserve to be sick, but make the most of it.
Oh yes, I can sympathise. I'm not sick, just sick & tired of it all.. My folks have gone on their mini road trip today. Mum can just get into a car (Dad basically turns her). Last time they arrived home both totally exhausted, she was dehydrated, with wet pants & in full emotional meltdown. Impossible to get into Sister's house & use bathroom - used church hall next door with disabled access/toilet.
But it's their circus today.
Well wishes Dorker.
Negative Nanny
Realist
Seeing/perceiving things that aren't there?
So this weekend, estranged brother's eldest son .. the one who was supposed to have accompanied estranged brother's .. youngest son .. and a visit here a couple of months back .. (eldest son bailed out at the last minute, unable to get a flight, so youngest was the only one that came). The eldest son .. called on Saturday AM .. to SIL .. and that he was booking a flight .. to come in on Sunday AM .. and would depart here, on Monday AM .. and just .. wanted to visit with his granny .. at the NH .. and also . if possible, see/visit the rest of us.
Wanted also the opportunity to maybe go through some things in his short stay here, . and maybe any little mementos that are meaningful, have the opportunity to take some of those things.
His words to SIL: "I'd like to maybe .. I'll fly in about late AM . and head to Granny house .. and maybe if I can have the opportunity at that point to go through some pictures or things like that . and then we'll head on over to see Granny for a while .. and then if we could all get together for dinner, so I can visit with the rest of you".
It was thought, the above scenario . one in which he goes to visit MIL for a bit, . and then we "all gather for dinner", ...
That would mean either
A) Carting MIL outta there for dinner
B) Bring dinner in and "all" gather . there at Purgatory
or
C) "We" all meet for dinner, which then leaves MIL outta the equation
Option B . was the choice taken.
So we all gathered there at Purgatory .... EB's eldest son already there, with SIL and SIL's hubby . and so the rest of us came to Purgatory . and we had dinner delivered there, had the dining room set aside, for just us.
Observation: It almost seemed to me (but am I seeing/perceiving things not there, .. am I the negative nanny, am I the realist) .. seemed to me that MIL was mostly .. I dunno .. maybe missing the boat there. It seemed to me that she was not all that engaged .. maybe just an observer to it all .. and not much else . and maybe a lot of it all lost on her, the ability to keep up w/conversation and participate in any of it.
She said in the end, to SIL who carted her back to her room after the festivities were over, . she told SIL "that was nice, I enjoyed it". But I don't know .. didn't seem she was engaged enough to "enjoy" it, .. just .. almost as if we'd nabbed any other resident there on site, and carted them into the scene there, and they were nothing more than an observer to the scene ongoing.
I mentioned that to DH as we left, .. and his response: "She was probably sad, . she'd like nothing better than to be at her home, . enjoying watching all of us .. and interacting . and she can't be .. probably makes her sad".
Me; "or maybe the presence of EB's eldest son . .maybe a stark reminder that she'll never see EB again .. and that brings sadness .. or maybe she just isn't all that able to engage any longer and most of it, was far too fast moving for her to keep up at all".
We had there, myself and DH .. SIL and her hubby ... EB's oldest son and his S/O, .. and OD and YD and DD and her hubby and their 6 yo and their twins. It was quite the commotion all of it. The little ones, since we had the dining area all to ourselves . running amok and playing the whole time . and that MIL did seem to watch .. not really commenting .. but watching/observing.
Was just really stark to me .. how "not" a part of things she seemed. Almost an observer that doesn't even know these people.
And then also of note ... and I wondered if it dawned on anyone else, as it did me.
At one point when the meal was finished .. it was noticed that MIL was making her way in her wheelchair to the doors of the dining area .. and struggling . on her own .. to get the door open . obvious she wanted to exit ..
This then brought about with a flurry ... SIL attempt
attempt to assess and assist .. and so she got the door open and was pushing MIL out asking what's wrong . and it turned out MIL had to go to the bathroom . and so I guess she was making her way on her own .. til SIL saw this and offered her presence/assistance, but SIL also summoning YD . who happened to be handy . to help.
They were gone forever ...
In the end, that story .. they'd gone out SIL and YD .. w/MIL to go find a bathroom for MIL (a struggle all on it's own . seemed the "commons" bathrooms all had someone occupying them .. MIL's room .. too far .. as to go there and use that bathroom). They did finally find an open bathroom, but that specific one . not wheelchair friendly .. (whoda thunk it .. in a NH) and so .. back at it, the search on . to find a suitable bathroom, one finally found, but no riser thing on the commode, and so much assistance needed from SIL . and from YD to get her lowered down onto what is a normal ADA toilet with no accommodation to make it higher than what is just an ADA toilet ..
Turned out she'd urinated in the Depends .. and so .. then having to go get more Depends . take off her clothing and shoes .. to get her cleaned up and changed .. and her clothing back on her .. and to hear YD tell it, the monumental struggle of holding onto MIL who has no legs at all, to help .. and lowering her to the toilet and lifting her, etc etc etc.
I did ask of YD but this was all after the fact, .. "Why did you guys not call for assistance from staff". YD: I don't know, I guess we just didn't think of it, we just .. me and SIL .. we just did it, dealt w/it".
YD then talking of the struggle .. to get MIL's shoes back on her .. and YD's words "her feet are so big .. you just about can't get her shoes back onto her feet .... it's monumental to try to do".
Yea, I know .. see the comments from last week.
I didn't question it out loud .. but it did dawn on me .. "does anyone else have any realization around the fact, . had we carted her outta there to dinner, . something others seem all too ready to do .. seemingly . that whole scene . the now wet Depends and need to get her cleaned up and changed . would've been in the confines of a public bathroom at whatever setting we'd of landed in".
Just some interesting observations from it all.
SIGH
That along with having to bite my tongue .. when we were all there at MIL's for EB's eldest son and S/O to go thru some things . and EB's eldest son said the following: "Does granny not want to be here .. doesn't she want to be here to help sort thru some things .. and maybe help to divy up what goes to who".
I wanted to knock him right in his noggin, . .and say to him: "You .. who haven't been on the scene here for what ...???....has it been 10 years or 12 .. or 15 .. how long? You have NO IDEA ... No earthly idea . none . zilch . nadda ....what has gone on here .... YES .. she'd like nothing better than to be right here, among it all, ... she doesn't want to BE WHERE SHE IS ...................... wants to come home . but has no capacity to live here anymore, and care for herself . hasn't in a long long time but you and yours wouldn't know that .. you haven't been around . .and not only that .. if we allowed that she come here to be a part of all of it, to sort thru things .. it would be drama like you've never seen, to get her extricated from here and back to Purgatory . you have no clue!".
I stopped myself and didn't say that, because in the end, he hasn't been around . nor has his younger brother, or his dad . but they had no obligation to be a part of all this . those of us that have been a part of all this . thru the years .. and know it all front/b'ward and sideways . did so of our own fruition, . so not fair to blast him .. as I almost wanted to do, .. so I didn't.
Just also stark to me .. how clueless .. having not been a part of things .. and not seeing the progression of how we got here.
It doesn't matter if MIL is engaged or not. She has dementia. My mother enjoyed seeing her children, grands and great grands and extended family at her NH during holiday and birthday celebrations. She mostly observed and smiled. Very little talk, because she had aphasia and I couldn't be sure she could follow anything but the simplest conversation.
Some folks in my family denied (and still deny) that my mom had dementia. My wonderful SIL gave a brilliant and detailed description of mom sitting up, singing along and clapping and enjoying one of her great grandbabies the night before she died (she was on Hospice).
After hearing this description on the phone, I started to doubt my own sanity, and our decision to bring in hospice. My brother called me later and said "Sis, that whole description of what happened last night? It's all in R's head: Mom was completely out of it. Just wanted you to know so you wouldn't think YOU were losing your marbles".
Dorker, denial is the MOST powerful defense mechanism there is. It allows folks to stay in their own fluffy-cloud reality and not get hurt. You will not break through their denial. Don't even try.
DH's sadness is symptomatic of the fact that he is no longer so much in denial. It's progress, for what that's worth, I think.
To your nephew, I would have simply said, "Grandma has dementia and many physical frailties. Bringing her here would not be a good plan."
It was decided we'd order from Olive Garden, .. delivery of dinner.
It was also marked as a celebration of bdays for DD's husband and also for OD (bdays are this week for those two). And so a bday cake also purchased.
SIL: "Oh that's great .. you remember, .. MIL used to always take the kids for their bdays to Olive Garden .. that's what she always did when they were kids".
In those days .. one could go to Olive Garden if it was your bday and they'd sing HBD and bring you a free slice of cake.
MIL did used to do that when the g'kids were all younger. Mine .. she could do so . on their bdays . we all live here. Not so with SIL's kids and with EB's kids . they didn't live local. Didn't stop her .. maybe they'd be here in the summer for a visit .. but off they'd go for the bday dinner, at Olive Garden .. irregardless the specific kid .. had a bday months prior. I guess no need to show proof at Olive Garden . and so she'd cart them for dinner, to Olive Garden, complete with the celebratory song from staff and free piece of cake.
As SIL put it, .. "oh that'll be great, . remember how she used to take them all to Olive Garden for their bdays?".
When SIL said that, ... my thought .. "yea probably means more to all of us than her, she probably doesn't even remember".
So . sure enough here we all were, sitting having our Olive Garden dinner that had been delivered there .. and SIL .. "Mom remember when you used to take the g'kids for their bday dinners to Olive Garden".
No response.
EB's oldest son .. now chiming in: "Olive Garden is sending over an investigator, they want to talk to you about years and years of free bday cake .. and no proof it was anyone's bday".
Blank stare from MIL.
I chimed in also (being funny): "yea I think I heard they're bringing a Holiday Inn Executive also . they want reimbursement for all the towels you swiped from their pool area.
Something else MIL did for the gkids when they were all young .. a trip to the beach for the day .. and there on the beach was a Holiday Inn . for use of those who are customers there. Didn't stop MIL ... off she'd march up to the pool area of the Holiday Inn . w/gkids in tow . and swipe a towel or two from the stack there, so as to appear to be a guest there . I mean .. afterall .. she has their towel .she must be staying here. Have her g'kid(s) enjoy a day of swimming in the pool .. and frolicking at the beach for the day.
Thus my statement .. "yea I think Holiday Inn is sending an executive also, they wanna talk to you about those missing towels".
Blank stare.
SIL asking of her mom: "Do you remember doing that?".
Her mom .. "no".
Moment passed now .. over with.
Was just sad to me .. it obviously left an impression on everyone else .. those things she did . but she now .. apparently has no memory of it. Not really.
The textbook dementia stuff says "never say 'do you remember when'"; you say something like, "we had such a good time when we...." and SHARE the memory; no quizzes!
I'm sure she had a grand time seeing you all, especially OD and EB's eldest and the great grandbabies.
The trip to the NH bathroom should dissuade at least YD from taking part in any MIL outing, don't you think?
Dorker you arent being a negative Nancy at all. You’re realist. And you’re well aware of the reality here because you were the one taking care of MIL all those years and as an “in-law” it’s easier to things for what they are. I’m not surprised at the denial from her children and grandchildren, I think it’s somewhat expected, it’s easier to pretend everything is hunky dory when it’s really not. (Live on the cloud like Barb said). And that doesn’t mean you are a negative Nancy! It means they are in denial.
Did SIL notice how disengaged her mother was? Just wondering if it registered with SIL and if she said anything about it?
I will say I was .. at least to myself, .. as we came in last night from the whole shindig . and YD relaying all this to her dad . having carted MIL to the bathroom, the "assist" it took to get her onto the toilet, and up (he knows, he's assisted her himself, . as has he assisted her w/xfer to and fro the auto) .. he knows, all too well. And her also relaying to her dad that she'd had to wipe MIL's bottom after she finished toileting . that she'd chitapalooza'd a bit in the toilet there (not in her Depends) .. but .. wasn't able to wipe her own bottom . so having her stand up .. slumped over, holding onto a grab bar, having to turn her to even get her to that position.. and wiping her bottom for her (YD did this).
DH's response (that I listened to in silence): "She really is where she has to be .. she really just couldn't be here .. for us to care for her, .. or in her own home".
SIGH
I wanted to walk over and knock him in the noggin ... "what the h377 ever gave YOU ANY INCLINATION that here was an option .. e.v.e.r. ... or at her own home .. is this just now dawning on you".
Maybe just maybe it's a glimmer of light of the reality of all this .. that is bleeding thru the disillusion that she could have what she wants more than anything .. to be in her own home, doing for herself.
As YD then began to impart about her b'friend's g'ma that lives alone still, . 94 yo .. still drives (some) . is on a cane .. and does cook (some) .. and her marbles all in tact mentally ... YD's words: "I hate it for her .. I really do .. I wish GOD would just come take her, .. she wants to go . she's ready ... she's been ready .. she has no life .. I look at P's g'ma .. and we go visit her . and she still plays cards with the neighbor ladies and goes to luncheons . there at the condo complex .. and she still drives . .and cooks . and can care for herself ... granny .. she's so far gone ... she can't do any of that".
Maybe just maybe ... those who've had their heads stuck in the sand .. have pried their heads out of the sand or their butts . and have seen a glimmer of light, of the reality that "is".
No SIL didn't seem to notice, til I brought it up. We were back at MIL's to sort thru some pictures .. thru the years. I commented: "MIl sure was quiet . she didn't have a lot to say .. ".
This then brought response from EB's eldest son (who .. remember .. hasn't seen her for maybe 10/15 years) .. "is she normally more talkative?".
SIL: "If it's one on one .. yea . she talks more .. ".
Me: "I think it's just too much for her to keep up with the flow of ongoing conversation .. and all the hullabaloo ongoing there, with the kids running around, and everyone talking, . she has Dementia and so . maybe it was all lost on her . .her ability to engage and keep up".