I've posted before about in-law care-giving. Aged mother in law, lives in same town.
We are at the tail end of a visit from sister in law from several states away. Sister in law has been here for 3 weeks caring for her mother. A much welcome respite.
It had been discussed, prior to her arrival here on the scene, she would be talking it over with her mother, to try and get her mom to come up to her home, for a stay of maybe a few months.
This, in my opinion, is absolutely essential, as I am expecting twin grand-children, due in about 1 month (if they don't come sooner, as is the case a lot of times with multiples pregnancies). The expectant mother also lives locally here, and has a 4 year old daughter. I will be on that front, helping .. as much as is needed. And not on the front with mother in law and care-giving, and have made that as obvious and apparent as I know how to make it. It would be great if mother in law would agree to go to her daughter's home (several states away) for a period of a few months .. and allow me the latitude to put my energies where I want them to be, on my daughter who will have had a c-section .. and my grand-daughter (4 years old) and new twin babies.
Nothing doing. Mother in law has dug in her heels, and will not hear of it, going to stay with her daughter for any period of time.
What are her reasons?
In mother in law's defense ... her daughter ... I don't even know how to describe it. I will say that when her daughter comes here to visit, she all but breathes for her mother and if she could find a way to do that, she'd do that too. She is the most nervous nelly, never sit down - ever ... worry wart, do everything, all the time .. person that I've ever encountered.
A great example, as I was taking her to the airport yesterday for her departure, . I reached into the fridge to grab myself a bottled water and shut the fridge and turned to walk away, as I've done for all of my 50 plus years living on this earth .. and she said to me, "Oh make sure that fridge shut". WTH???? Like I don't know how to shut a fridge? That's just a small, very small slice of what she is ... how she is.
She is so very hyper-vigilant, seeing to every minute details down to it's finest most minuscule point, fine tooth comb, questioning every point along the way, "should we do thus and so, but maybe if we do thus and so, then such and such will happen, maybe we should do it thus and so .. but then so and so might happen, maybe we shouldn't do thus and so, but do "x" "y" and "z" instead, but if we don't do it that way then ..........", on and on and on and on it goes. And usually in hyper warp speed, as to every single friggin thing.
If her mother moans .. "what's wrong mother?, why did you moan, are you alright?".
Mother: "Yes, I'm fine, I was just sighing out loud".
Sister: "Why did you sigh? Are you hurting, are you sure you're alright, why are you sighing what's the matter?"
Mother: "For God's sake __________________, I was just sighing, .. calm down, I'm fine".
Sister: "Are you sure, .. because if something is wrong you need to tell me".
Mother: "Everything is fine, I'm fine".
Sister: "Are you sure, we did a lot yesterday, did we do too much, maybe we shouldn't of gone to two doctors in one day .. was that too much for you, are you too tired now, maybe we need to move those other doctor appointments so we won't have two in one day, is that too much for you, for one day .. is that why you were sighing .. what's wrong, are you sure you're alright".
Hopefully that kinda gives a little bit of a snapshot of what goes on when sister is in the ring directing things.
So in mother in law's defense.. I do get it, why she wouldn't be chomping at the bit to go to her daughter's home.
BUT ....
The only experience she has with her daughter, in the last years as mother in law has aged and been unable to go anywhere much, has been the daughter coming here, periodically, for periods of about 3 weeks at a stretch. When her daughter comes here, she moves heaven and earth for her mother and then some, and doesn't sit down, doesn't stop .. the WHOLE ENTIRE TIME.
Is there a possibility maybe (as I said to mother in law, when she expressed that isn't happening - talking to me - her going to her daughters .. ever) .. could it be possible that maybe if you would go to where she lives .. she'd be more busy managing her own life in that setting than your's and she would get out of your backside .. and not be as hyper-drive-vigilant as you experience in her, when she's here, could that be possible.
The daughter is retired, lives several states away. Does come here, generally, every few months .. and stays for a period of about 3 weeks at a stretch. I wish I could make a list of everything the daughter did when here this last time, but it would take up the whole character allotment:
I know that the Activities Director was more than elated that MIL had taken it upon herself to go out into the commons area and try to strike up conversation with those "slumpers" as she calls them. Activities Director "Wish everyone would be so friendly".
She did, at one point, bump into a problem there, in that .. I guess one of the folks she was striking conversation with had asked in some form/fashion to be left alone. And it sounds like kind of a dust up (minor) ensued . wherein, MIL persisted, maybe thinking the person merely needs to be pulled out of their shell more, don't know. But in the end, the person got angry w/MIL when she wouldn't stop pestering her, as it was termed . .and this dust up was seen by staff who then escorted MIL away from the broohaha .. and said of it, "your mother doesn't really, at this point, pick up on social queues". I concur, she does not.
This same thing (though the peril of not picking up on social queues is always at play in it), .. is something she was "enjoying" and finding purpose in. It's the same thing that K (former roomie) said to her "these people don't like you and wish you'd leave them alone, you need to leave them alone".
It was something she enjoyed (as much as one in her state can find *enjoyment* in anything) .. but now it sounds like K has done her best to squelch that. And MIL heeding.
I wouldn't . most of us wouldn't .. if cautioned by another resident .. wouldn't listen . and just do what we want as long as it's okay with staff. But .. we have all cognition firing on all cylinders (supposedly). I guess K's words were enough to send MIL reeling from that task. As she put it, "here I was trying to be helpful, I can't do much ... there's nothing much I can do .. but I was trying to be helpful, but then K said those people don't like me and wish I'd leave them alone, so I can't even do that anymore".
To DH responding to her, "Mom don't pay any attention to what K says . she doesn't own the place here, if you want to do that, do it".
Like I said, there is always ever-present, the peril that she may run afoul of someone who is disinterested in her conversation . and maybe acts out .. and that cause a bit of a dust up . that's always there in the endeavor. And she's not of the mindset, as you can see w/all this . to be one to just dust it off, if somehow there is a bit of a scene .. it doesn't fall off her like water off a duck's back.
Hopefully the Activities Director, knowing MIL's problems, will be on the lookout for someone who would welcome her friendship. When our somewhat shy Mom became widowed, we asked the Activities Director at her new AL to help her make friends and pull her into activities. Worked well for Mom to have someone come by her room and announce it was time to go to crafts, chair exercise, sing-along, etc.
Xmas day: bring something to do: a cake to decorate, a small Xmas tree, photos to cut out & stick to the wall - anything that moves her hands & destracts her.
I used to always take my Mum around the gardens in the wheelchair in respite care. I think we were all happier for a change of scene (at least she was distracted from talking about her washing for 10 minutes...)
On the other front, .. w/MIL . and SIL. Sheesh.
Barb said something the other day, a voice of such sound reasoning ... she'd advised to let my husband take the lead on these texts, .. if he doesn't respond . then I don't have to either. That resonated w/me.
Got a text two days ago .. two long paragraphs .. group texted to both DH and myself .. and she imparting that she'd talked to the psych and the SW .. and asked that they encourage their mom to not be responsible for H and her whereabouts . and work with her on that .. and they agreed they'd do so.
That text came in to both DH and myself. I waited for DH to respond .. and as is typical .. nothing. If he even reads texts from her, I'm not aware of it. No response from him, at all. I didn't respond either.
It kinda washed over me, .. at that moment .. a feeling of "if you want to be absolutely obsessed and consumed with all things your mom . have at it, . but if you can't tell .. no one else is that consumed with it".
The next day .. I purposely waited until the next day to even respond. I asked of her, "Did you ask the SW about this supposed issue your mom keeps harping on, that everyone is leaving there, staff/residents, they're all leaving".
Important, one of the catalysts to where SIL was ready to sign on the dotted line for a private room .. part of it was H . and her blowback . but also part of it, was to isolate her mom to her own private room . so she wouldn't be "subject" I guess to the scuttlebutt around there. That whole notion .. "everyone is leaving" .. that whole piece, .. I was suspect, but seemed I was the only one.
I don't take everything their mom says .. as does SIL . and run with it, with my hair on fire, to solve it in an instance. DH certainly doesn't, by any stretch.
Asked of her the next day did she talk with the SW and dial in on this "everyone is leaving here" piece. She answered that no, she'd forgotten to ask that question but would when SW calls her back. She answered further that she'd reached out to Medicaid Betty on that one ... (Medicaid Betty does this for a living and so has a finger on the pulse at different settings) .. and that she'd also put in a call to the SW at the atty office, to get her feel for that specific question . and the SW at the atty office, hadn't yet returned her call. Said Medicaid Betty did respond and no, hadn't heard any of that, that all the residents/staff are leaving there.
BTW .. none of this is getting DH's attention at all. He's not weighing in.
I only responded "interesting". Put the phone down and didn't respond any further, and of course, DH never did weigh in on any of it. Never does.
She did add that she'd put in a call to the Admissions person to question how much is a private room. No response, from either DH or me on that one.
Then a day later she texted she'd talked to the SW and said that the SW had spoken to her mom about H . and that she'd urged her mom to not feel as if she is responsible as to H's whereabouts . that's the staff's job, that she doesn't need to keep track of H. She said the SW indicated that no, . one of the head nurse personnel departed for a better job . but that's the only staff member that has left .. or intends to leave . and the only residents that have left, . .was one man who died . there aren't "all of the residents are leaving".
No weigh in from DH . none from me, no response. Again, that feeling washing over me of
I don't know, it's sort of a feeling of anger and bewilderment . that she is so absolutely consumed (OCD) as to her mom . and all things her mom . and maybe doesn't have enough to do with her life . that she has the time to dial in to the degree she does so ... not the case with me .. and obviously . not with DH . as he rarely even weighs in on these texts, at all.
I didn't respond . nor did DH.
No response at all.
Then last night ... another group text in that same thread . that her mom's salt shaker has come up missing (again, I think this is like the 3rd time in recent months) . that her mom wants . for xmas . would one of us go by McD's and get a bunch of those little paper salt packets for her.
No response from this end, not from me, not from DH. If he isn't gonna respond with a simple "ok" . then I won't either.
Then about an hour later another text from her .. for all she knows these texts are going to some cyberspace black hole, because she's getting no response.
Another text, this one imparting that their mom is so sad . that this is unlike any xmas she's ever had in her entire life. Told her mom to try and reflect back on the many xmas's spent with family and enjoyment and maybe focus on the true reason for the season . instead of the family and presents. She goes on in this long paragraph to describe how hard it is for her mom, that she's been with her mom for most xmas's . and that she was here for her mom's bday and for tgiving .. said but her mom is missing her being here.
She then questions whether Purgatory will have a church svc on Xmas eve and/or Xmas day .. w/a question mark.
This text came in last night .. DH and I both here, present .. he didn't even pick up his phone to look at it, at all.
I gotta tell ya ... we'd just come in from having dinner out with DD & family and having taken the kids to see Santa .. and it was so cute and heartwarming that none of them cried .. weren't real crazy about the big jolly fella . and somewhat wary of him . but none of them cried .. it was so cute . and so special to have gotten to be a part of that scene, then enjoyed dinner out with them, .. then they went their way, we ours. Got home . and that text came in.
It really just kinda incensed me .. SIL and her OCD with her mom and all things her mom. Asking if there is a church svc there.
YOUR MOM DOESN'T PARTAKE OF ANY THING THERE . NOT CHURCH SVC OR OTHERWISE ..........
That is her, prompting .. I know her well .. .prompting .. if we'd take that bull and run with it .. find out if there is a church svc and go .. and take her .. maybe she'll go if you guys go.
Well .. what she isn't even taking into consideration at all, and I'm done trying to "inform" her .. is that we do have a church svc at our church . on xmas eve . and we have our own family plans that evening to gather here for dinner, . and then all of us go to our church service, . and then come back here for present xchange .. and so .. our plans are kinda in the works already .. as to what we'll do on xmas eve.
So her obsession with her mom . .and how to fix the latest (the saddest xmas) . "wonder if there is a church svc there at NH .. on xmas eve or Xmas" ..
NOT GONNA BE MY OBSESSION.
It kinda angered me.
At that point, mostly because I was kinda angered by it ... I swear you guys .. it's every day . there is something wrong .. e.v.e.r.y.d.a.y. EVERYDAY . and so texts get shot this way . and some supposed prompt to hop to .. some of it simple some of it far flung . but .. e.v.e.r.y.d.a.y. ENOUGH ALREADY.
At that point, I did reach out to DH who was sitting right here, ..
Me: "Hey DH . a text from your sister .. and read it to him . word for word ..
He thought a moment .. and responded: "Mom should be up there with you sister" . is what he said out loud .. said "tell her mom should be up there with her".
I did that, .. because I agree one million percent. She is the one who
It is a freaking AL, full of OLD people with LOTS of health issues. I don't think anyone there is younger than 85. There is a woman who is 103 (and looks and acts younger than all the other residents).
She too has made the comment "All the staff is leaving!" after one person, her favorite, moved on to another employer.
She is the one who is so absolutely consumed with all things her mom . on a daily basis .. and then texting as to updates . texting as to need/whim/want .. texting as to sadness and despair .. texting texting texting . daily .. as to all things her mom.
I agree one million percent ..
Back when it became evident she'd need to be placed .. and any consideration as to placement in IL . got nixed in MIL's assertion "this is not my home here in IL .. I want to go back to FL, I belong in FL ... these aren't my kinda people here in IL"
IL got nixed .. and so SIL and her participation daily in her mom's life . it would be from afar . because SIL isn't going to move here to FL . and MIL is going to insist she be returned to FL.
So DH's response .. "she should be there with sister, tell my sister she should be there with her".
I did text that to his sister, "Your brother says, she should be there with you".
I mean .. c'mon ... gonna now lay that at our feet here .. it's such a sad xmas for her, unlike any she's ever had in her life ..
It's an underhanded prompt on her part, that we somehow take those plates she's spinning in the air in her mom's state of being . and start spinning them ourselves, on this end .. in the endeavor to jump to the beat of making their mom happy (something I see as impossible . she'll never be happy).
We on this end . have many irons in the fire . at this time of year .. DH is busy at work, we have some social engagements with regard to church . g'children . one of whom is a school child with school programs associated to xmas . we wish to attend .. and "other" family (my dad) that also need to be considered (as we did having dad for a luncheon here last wknd) .. and menu planning . as to what to fix for different events . and so forth.
In other words, .. "I'm busy .. I am not consumed with your mother's state of being, nor am I gonna be . you obviously don't have E.N.O.U.G.H. to do and I have way too much to do .. and you are pestering me" was my kinda mindset on it all.
So I did respond that DH says she should be there with you. And I added, "we'll be seeing her xmas day". And left it at that. Thought that'd be good enough.
Damit .. we are busy . today I have a billion presents to wrap ... I have to go to the store to get some ingredients to make a cake that has to sit up in a wrap of whiskey for a couple of days ..
We are all busy ...
I thought it would suffice to simply respond to her that their mom should be there with her .. (she's the one so consumed with it all) as per her brother's sentiments .. sent that to her, and then added, "We'll be going to see her xmas day".
There ya go . there's your assurance, wrap yourself in that as your security blanket as to all things your mom ... yep . your brother says your mom should be there with you . that's his take on it all .. and .. we will be seeing her on xmas day . let that settle you and all your OCD ...
Then I wake up this morning to a text from her, in that same thread .. I guess came in after I went to bed, her asking "are you guys going to visit and eat with her on xmas day".
GAWD ALMIGHTY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
In fact on that topic .. DH and I both have been weighing all week .. we are going to be just us on xmas day .. family all .. otherwise spoken for and not visiting on xmas day so it is to be just the two of us.
He had debated having our preacher and his wife for xmas dinner, as they have no family visiting this year . and will also be alone .. and so we'd weighed having them . he and I all week tossing about .. "should we have the preacher and his wife .. or should we just forgo cooking altogether and go and have lunch with your mom at Purgatory and spend some time with her".
I have left that in his court, .. I don't care either way .. to be honest. I'll cook and we can have the preacher and his wife . if that's his preference .. or I'll not cook at all, and we can go visit his mom ..
How in the WORLD have you refrained from simply telling SIL "Leave me the heck ALONE! Stop, stop, stop pestering me about MIL!"?
I'd have blocked her permanently. A long time ago!
You don't have to take direction from SIL.
No response might get her to reflect upon her actions. Kind of like a therapist sitting silently can get a client to hear her/his own thoughts and articulate them better.
Follow DH's lead. When you visit MIL, ask her what she wants/needs and supply it.
All week he and I have been tossing that notion back and forth . undecided ..
Until yesterday he finally opted .. his words: "I don't think we'll try to have the preacher for xmas day .. would you be alright with just going to Purgatory to have lunch with mom there, whatever they're serving there".
That was yesterday when he finally made a decision .. and no .. I don't care either way .. and so I had answered him . that's fine with me . .but you need to go by Purgatory and get our names in that hat as to whatever they're serving . and pay the $3 pp .. otherwise there will be no meal served for us.
I asked him last night, once he'd made that decision earlier yesterday .. did he get by Purgatory to get that taken care of and no he didn't.
Will he?
I don't care . to be honest .. I'll sit here and eat a PBJ .. .doesn't matter to me .. if that's what he wants to do .. and wants me to join . then go take care of it, . don't wanna . then fine by me ..
So that's kinda how all that sits at the moment...
So then to wake up and find that what I thought would suffice in answering SIL . that we will be seeing her mom on xmas day .. I thought that would suffice .. she's so sad . this is unlike any xmas shes's ever had .. and .. wondering if there is a church svc (that I guess we can upend our worlds to go attend to .. NOT) ...
I "THOUGHT" I had answered to it . and enough so that she could now wrap up her obsessions in a nice neat little box and shelve them. Nope .. I then wake up this morning to a text that came in after I went to bed . that same group thread so DH got it to and there's been no response from him (he's gone already this AM) .. asking if we're going to eat there with their mom.
GOOD GAWD!
I haven't answered it, only because at this point . I'd like to respond w/something akin to .. "Look obviously you are the one so consumed with all things your mom . no one on this end is so consumed .. we are all otherwise BUSY . and have far too much to do unlike you . to concern ourselves to this degree .. can you not just take the word that we intend to see her on xmas day and go with that . and be okay with that . do you have to know every finite frickin detail . would you like to know what time I intend to brush my teeth too ... get over yourself .. if we eat with her or don't . there's not a dam thing you can do from afar as to assurance that your mom is okay . and being attended to . her son lives here . the degree with which he is gonna engage in all that . is evident to you and has been for a long long time .. and so . .l.e.t. i.t. G.O.".
I haven't responded to her, because the above is about the flavor it would have if if I did so.
I am angry with her at this point .. we all have enough to do .. more than enough . and her obsession with all things her mom and underhanded prompts .. .are not falling on this end with softness. I am over it!
It sounds to me as though SIL and MIL have a very enmeshed, codependent relationship. (Maybe it's just one sided, I dont know if there is another term for that).
SIL experiences any problem that her mom has as though it is happening to HER. It must be corrected IMMEDIATELY!
Yes, MIL belongs in Illinois with SIL. Have you suggested that to her lately?
You might also remind her that MIL and NH both have your phone numbers if her mom has any genuine wants or needs.
PS, why not get some nice takeout to bring MIL for Christmas lunch!
Here was her response: "She hated it in IL .. hates the climate there . .at least here, she can get outside some (that's true enough) .. and she loves to be able to go sit outside when the weather is suitable . can't do that in IL ... not in the winter . and she says .. those people aren't her kinda people .. a lot of immigrants there .. she just wanted to be in FL.
Followed by her adding that her husband has said of her (and I agree) that it's good their mom decided to be in FL and not in IL . as SIL would work herself into the grave if her mom was close by .. attending to her hourly by the minute of every day.
And yes, I've even taken the conversation with SIL . to the degree (and she admits it . .. though ... for her, it's from a standpoint that she's so close to her mom . they've always been close and been good friends .. and that she so loves her . and wishes things could be better for her) .. I've even taken it to the table for discussion with her, . that she has to come to some realization that there are no whirligigs that will fix it all . .they don't exists .. and she ............ SHE .......... SIL ...........has to find a way to sit with that .. and "know" .. that yes, it's sad .. it's crummy . that her mom can't be happy ... but that she can't "fix" it . and be finding some way to be relatively "ok" with that.
As I said . .she cloaks the above in her .. how close she and her mom have always been .. she cloaks the above (I call it as you did, co-dependence and enmeshment) . she cloaks it all in how much she loves her mom and wants to make her mom's life better .. and how much she hates all this for her, .. and that she loves her mom . and so on and so forth.
That's where that conversation goes.
I have even suggested she get counseling .. as I think the two of them are too enmeshed .. I have said that to her. That too gets answered to with the above flavor .. that she loves her mom, that they're close, always have been . yadda yadda.
I have even taken it to the table to discuss with her . that perhaps that was the wrong decision . that her mom be given the latitude to return to FL .. as ... her brother is obviously not going to be as attentive to their mom . .. he simply doesn't have the time . nor the inclination to do so .. and I long since walked away from satisfying the whims of SIL/MIL .. and so .. her being here in FL . yes she can get outside to enjoy the sunshine .. on a lot of days . but that is all she got in returning here. Yes, she has a son who lives here . but we see just how engaged he is .. the whims/wants of his mom ... he is usually unaware . .as he doesn't talk to his mom .. 2 and 3 times daily as does SIL.
Yes, she has a DIL (me) that lives here . but I don't go all that often to see her .. and if I do it's with DH .. and I don't ever just call her and chit chat on the phone . .I long since quit doing that .. .well before she even left here to go to IL . was "done" (at least speaking for myself) with the whines and moans of it all ... and no pliability in their mom . done w/it . long ago. So I don't call their mom . and I don't go all that often to visit .. and yes she has g'children that live here in our daughters . but . we have OD who won't go see her, because of OD and her own mental frailties . and a place where MIL brings the dialogue . and OD can't deal with it. DD is busy . she has 3 small kids .. and doesn't have time. YD .. also busy working for a living and her own social life .. and so . for the most part, .. yes she has family here . but for varying reasons .. that family that live here . don't go see her on any kinda routine basis.
I've had that conversation with SIL .. trying to get her to see . that maybe that decision shouldn't
shouldn't have been heeded in their mom's case .. and perhaps that should be rethought ..
And that too gets met w/some return dialogue along the lines of ... "well .. she is all in all happier in FL than she'd be here in IL . she doesn't like the climate here ... can't get outside to enjoy the outdoors . and .. not her kinda people here .. and so .. all in all, she wanted to be in FL . and so .. that's what we had to go with".
To my responding to SIL .. as I said before, .. "then maybe you're going to have to find a way to "sit" with the knowledge that it won't all be okay all the time .. it never will be . she's gonna be sad . she was sad before she even was placed . there will be things that are wrong in her hemisphere .. and can't be fixed ... find a way to "sit" with that and be okay with it, get yourself some counseling I dunno .. I mean you see that no one here is going to be as consumed as you are as to the daily hiccups that go on . there simply won't be that much attention to it all here . it's not gonna happen".
To SIL . .(these are real conversations that have been had) .. and her return dialogue . "Well I just hate it for her, it's a lot for her to navigate at these end days of her life . people around her dying .. and others that are so far gone . they are out of it . and .. it's just a lot of sadness for her . and I hate it that her end days have to be so sad for her, and I love her so much and wish I could make it better for her, I mean . ya know . she can't find her pj bottoms or top . or someone swipes her hairbrush or her shampoo . or whatever . and all the while . someone is dying . or ... someone has gotten carted out to the hospital .. or whatever, it's a lot for her to have to deal with and the other residents some of them .. pretty impaired ..
To my input on that: "SIL as I've said you need to find a way to "sit" with the knowledge some of it can't be fixed . and be okay with that .. because you can't "fix it" .. you can't go in there and wave a magic wand to make all these folks fully functional and now your mom isn't surrounded by the sadness of dying/sick people . that's the reality of where she needs to be at this point in her life as to her own needs . you can't fix that ...
It just goes round and round and round.
Thus my .. having taken what was said about let DH take the lead . if he doesn't respond (and he doesn't .. I bet 98 times out of 100 . no response from him at all) .. and there used to be a day that I'd prompt him . .I'd be in his azz . respond to your sister .. causing consternation between he and I .. I don't do that any longer. I took that to heart, .. and have left her texts over the last few days . hanging . with no response.
I did ... last night . I thought that was kind of me, to respond to her, that we'll be seeing their mom on xmas day ... I thought that was kind of me . and assuring to her . but then she wants to know if we'll be eating there with her.
WTH?!?!?!?
What if I answered her "No . we are going to the finest of finery as to a restaurant for the day and with some friends . and we have zero intention of spending one iota of a minute with your mom".
That's not the case . but what if I did respond with that .. there's not a dam thing she can do about it ...
So why not "let it go" when you get a response that we'll be seeing her on xmas day . let it go .. and be "ok" with that as your knowledge piece on what will transpire as to comforting you as to your mom's sadness at this is the worst xmas ever in her life . just be "ok" with knowing we have every intention of visiting their mom on xmas day . just be "ok" w/that .. and let it go.
I'm kind of coming from a place of .. if DH doesn't feel any compunction to impart to his mom (and he hasn't) "hey mom we're paying for and coming to join you for lunch at Purgatory on xmas day" . then I don't have to speak to it either. If DH doesn't feel any compunction to satisfy his sister's whims
And Chinese takeout is a wonderful idea - you could probably call up the place and ask them to use reduced sodium soy sauce so it's not so bad for MIL. However, if she eats the food, it's the nursing home's worry with her swelling, not yours. They have your numbers! ;)
if he doesn't feel compelled to answer to it with regard to his sister, then I won't either.
I'm coming from kinda a place that I don't feel like I have to justify to her . to satisfy her mom's sadness .. what our plans are.
As things stand at present . our plans are ... that on xmas eve .. no we won't be going to Purgatory to escort your mom to a church svc there if one is to be had . we will be attending our own church . and with our kids along . and g'kids . and having dinner here .. and opening presents . those are our plans for xmas eve .. and then
On xmas morning . we have been invited at dark-thirty in the AM to go to DD's house to be there when the kiddos wake up to see the santa that arrived under their tree and be a part of that scene and have a brunch there. Those are our plans for xmas morning . and so no . if there is a church svc to be held at Purgatory ... not gonna be there ...
Then .. we will .. make our way on to the NH . to go visit (possibly have lunch with her there) . and then come home.
I don't feel like I have to explain my itinerary to SIL . but in her incessant questioning and posing of different whirligigs and spinning tops . she is looking for just that . and I resent it.
You know your mom is sad . h377 she's been sad for years . you can't fix it, we've talked about that many times ... you're aware we intend to see her xmas day . be "ok" with that .. if it occurs at 9 AM . .if it occurs at 9 PM .. is out of your hands and you are annoying me .. with your underhanded prompts .. stop it.
In the end it did.
I blocked her thus didn't even see anything she texted .. didn't block DH .. as obviously I need to be able to text with him . on a daily basis . so sometimes I'd see him responding to something she sent . but would never see what her end of things were.
I guess at one point there was some question that was directed at me, that I was failing to speak to . and ... if DH had been listening ... I'd told him in advance that I was blocking his sister's ability to text me .. that I can't deal with her incessant questions/suggestions/prompts, etc ...
He wasn't "listening" ... what else is new.
I guess in the end .. it caused some consternation that no . didn't cause me unblock her .. what ultimately caused me to unblock her was her want to sit down with me and finally have a conversation wherein she imparted some apology for the way she had not listened to me, and the impact all this had on me . and I then did unblock her.
To block her, is seen by DH as being overly punitive. And yes, even in the face of my argument to him .. 'You routinely ignore her texts DH . what's the difference, .. I have zero responsibility to your sister or your mom .. and so if I block/ignore or otherwise .. I get to have that latitude ... ".
It caused argument between he and I, seen by him as being overly harsh. Even though her routinely ignores texts from her.
It's a set up in the end, for argument .. and oh I dunno . maybe discord under our roof for me to "block" her.
I haven't answered to her text that came in last night, as I can't do so nicely .. I don't have anything nice to say at this point.
DH could . if he would . pick up the phone and read the very same texts that were sent to him also .. in a group text . and respond to assure his sister that their poor poor mom will yes, .. he will see to it that we are paid for and have our names in that hat as to eating there with her, .. and assure her that all is well . and then she can shoot forth (wait for it, it's coming) . oh while you're there, would you try to find her comb . oh and her toothbrush . she says she can't find it .. oh and can you sort thru her pj's she says some of them are missing . can you talk to the nurse desk (the task list is coming, .. wait for it .. if she knows we're coming . she'll have our *to do* list at the ready).
He has the same text from her . and hasn't responded, .. so I haven't either. She isn't blocked . so I see what she texts . but as Barb advised .. let him take the lead. Yep. He obviously feels no need to respond . so I won't either.
I thought my responding we'd be seeing her on xmas day was sufficient . truly did .. I didn't think she needed the finite detail of what we plan to do as to eating that day ... so I haven't responded to that
If she finds it that important to dial in on that, she can certainly phone her brother and hope to get him to answer the phone.
It galls on my last dam nerve ..
I mean all this past week it was the rollator . and that whole saga .. and .. if it's not one thing it's 4 more .. routinely .. and I'm over it.
I have enough on my plate .. just in my own life .. and that's the point I tried to make so long ago .. that I cannot and won't be as attentive to their mom ..
Yet .. same story .. different day . continues.
Enmeshed .. h377 yes .. and then some!
For a gifted student, it takes 5-8 repetitions for something to be learned.
For an average learner, it takes 100 repetitions for something to be learned.
For a student with learning difficulties or with a cognitive deficit, it can take 1000 repetitions for something to be learned.
Telling SIL once that she needs to learn to sit with and cope with her mother's unhappiness is not going to cut it. You need a canned response to these hare-brained requests for things like salt shakers (they DO provide salt at the NH, if MIL is allowed it on her diet. If they don't provide, perhaps MIL isn't supposed to be salting her own food! What a concept!)
Everytime she starts in; " I'm sorry, I don't think that's important, I dont think we should do that, I dont think we need to get her that". And...
"Yes, your mother is unhappy. She was unhappy at home, unhappy in Illonois and will be unhappy where ever she is. She doesn't want to be old and there is not a d@mn thing any of us can do about that.".
Rinse and repeat.
They come up missing, 1 or the other, from time to time.
The horse has left the stable on that issue and debate which would surely ensue as those plates must all spin in unison at all times ..."maybe your mom doesn't need salt in her diet".
Too late to debate that issue.
Then there are the words that you say to a child - "next time...."
Unfortunately, both do leave the door open.
As far as the salt & pepper shakers go, does the facility not give her little packets with her meals? If she wants it, why wouldn’t she ask the staff when they deliver her meal? I wouldn’t continue to buy her the shakers and I sure as heck wouldn’t stop st McDonald’s to steal a few. I’d tell H to go buy a box of the little packets at costco or bjs or sams club or Smart & Final, whichever you have nearby. Heck maybe even regular grocery stores sell them? I’d tell him only once though. This reminds me of the time we visited FIL at the hospital earlier this year and as we were leaving they delivered his lunch. He liked pepper and wanted more than the 1 packet that came with his meal. As we were walking out, we passed by the gal who was delivering lunch & Hubby asked her To take his dad more pepper and she said she’d get right on it. And then when we passed the little cafe on the main floor, he walked in and grabbed a big handful of pepper packets and back up to FILs room we went! And who was in there delivering more pepper? The lunch gal!! But tbh I would have probably done the same if it was one of my parents. But at the time, I thought hubby was being a bit ridiculous!
reading all about SILs latest texts, the question running through my mind is.....does she think you all have no lives and are just sitting around waiting to be summoned? I think she knows H is busy with work and his church stuff & hunting trips. And I know she’s so enmeshed in her mother’s life....I just can’t believe it doesn’t occur to her that you have a life there in Florida and you are BUSY! And can’t be running every time time SIL gets a bee in her bonnet!
"Today is EB's bday, sure hope mom doesn't realize it. I'm sure not going to tell her".
Ignored.
Of course no response from DH, never is any.
I am choosing to ignore.
I would bet money MIL has no clue what today's date is, she no longer keeps up with dates to my knowledge.
No immigrants in FL?!!!
Hahahahah
My friend has been running her to various doctors and specialists for the last year or so and I see the toll it's taking on HER. Because, you CANNOT make a person with severe OCD happy/content--you just can't. They need medication and therapy and a desire to be better and 'M' doesn't have those things.
I DO feel sorry for her, but I can feel my eyes are starting to glaze over when she starts in on her DH and how he ignores her, or how bad her lymphedema is getting--the list goes on and on. She's on the phone with my friend everyday, whining and complaining and doing NOTHING to help herself. .
SIL seems to have a lot of these same qualities, and I personally think it must be beyond painful to be so obsessed over ANYTHING, whether it be yourself or someone else.
SIL has a sick and twisted relationship with her mom. I went through freakin' cancer and my sweet kids gave me space and called enough to let me know they were there and cared, and occasionally did things for me, but for the most part, I was on my own. They certainly didn't go steal pepper packets from McD's b/c I wanted more pepper. I think once one of them got me chicken soup from a favorite restaurant--but they most assuredly weren't 'hating' that I had cancer, and sending each other reams of texts on a daily basis about me. Perhaps my kids are a bit more well adjusted?
But then, we're not co-dependent and texting back and forth all day long. I see my in state kids once a week or so, a healthy amount. I imagine that in retirement we will still see them about that much. When the cancer returns, and it will, I will go gently into that good night and I HOPE and pray that none of them are distraught over it.
I've always maintained that you can live too long--we're going through this with my own Mother and MIL. They are the same age (in fact, went to school together, but my mother is kind of a snob and wouldn't have even acknowledged my MIL's existence.) Most of their problems are due to being 90 yo, poor choices and having a sense of entitlement that is incredible to me. My DH will get a call from his mom and go into a deep, dark funk. Knowing he has to deliver her Christmas gift in the next couple of days has him depressed and anxious.
MY SIL texts my DH and has never once looped me into a text or situation about their mother. I would not care if she did, but if she did it everyday, I'd lose my cookies. DH reads the texts and completely ignores them.
Dorker--I agree with other posters who think you need to go 'black rock' with SIL. She is clearly obsessed with someone you care about, but cannot help. You have a life and need to live it. Rocking the boat 24/7 is making your marriage strained and your inner peace non existent.
I can see how this is hard for your MIL - now that she is in NH and your SIL far away in IL - when she whines there is no one to jump through hoops to make her feel better. What a pill that old lady is. Not liking IL - too many immigrants - as if she ever got out to encounter any!!! Wanting SIL all to her self and SIL's husband be damned.
Enjoy your Christmas - let DH deal with SIL - but update us when it is all over as to the ongoing drama.
So the texts she'd been sending, got ignored. Whether or not we are going to "eat" with her mom . .is neither here nor there, IMO ... she's all the way in IL . and if she'd like to dial up "eat a meal with a friend" and have someone sent to her mom that's fine by me.
But I was growing resentful of the .. "let me direct you from afar"... piece of all this.
Yes, that is our intent . and we will indeed be going to share a meal there, at the NH . that will be our Xmas dinner, he and myself, joined with MIL at the NH .. and that's going to be our Xmas meal . .
But I didn't feel as though her prying and poking and subtle hints require any answering to, . we don't answer to her.
I had already assured her that her "saddest xmas ever mom" .. was going to be visited by us on Xmas day .. and yes, .. we had every intention of doing that, irregardless of whether we ate there or not . we would indeed make it a point to visit xmas day.
But it was decided by DH . that he'd rather go and eat there, . and have a meal with her, as part of our xmas day . rather than just the two of us here, . .no visitors . and bother cooking for just us two. Fine by me. So yes, we'll do that.
But my point here is this .. I don't owe her any explanation as to what my plans are for the day ... she can somehow figure out how to "sit" with the uncomfortable feeling I suppose it generates in her, . as to whether her mom will have a suitable enough visit by anyone no Xmas day, suitable to SIL.
So I never answered it, I resented the "prying" and that's just how it fell on my end.
And of course, DH never even reads any texts incoming from afar, or if he does he tucks the phone back on his hip and never responds.
I never responded nor did DH.
The next thing she then sent a text about . was whether (pondering) were there any religious services at NH .. either on Xmas eve or Xmas Day.
My thoughts on that, and I didn't respond were this.
If there are, and your mom wishes to partake of same .. that's wonderful, she should do so. But we aren't going to be able to be a part of that, .. more than likely (but mind you, again, I don't owe her any explanation as to what we're doing with our time and so forth) .. we can't be a part of carting her to any religious services . we are already spoken for. We are having Xmas eve dinner here, with ours .. our kids and g'kids . and then will attend our own church for Xmas eve services, where DH has a speaking role in the service, so he has to be there, and we wish to be also, .. and then . the next morning, on Xmas morning, we are invited to go to DD's at dark thirty in the AM . to be there before kiddos wake up to see what Santa has brought and be a part of that excitement . and we are to have a breakfast there as part of that whole scene.
So my point here is two different things.
1) We are already spoken for as to Xmas eve and any "want" on your part that we divert plans and go in the direction to cart your mom to any religious service that may or may not transpire .. we already have plans for Xmas eve.
2) We already have plans for Xmas morning, in the event there are any religious services on Xmas AM .. and so will be out of pocket attending to our own agenda on that AM . .and so if there are services . we will not be there for them.
3) I don't owe you all this explanation .. your prompts and prods .. are useless.
I never answered to them.. nor did DH.
No responses.
So . then . as we knew as coming ... YD as proposed to by her b'friend of two years. We knew it was coming .. he had done the traditional "ask the dad for permission" thing and so we all knew it was coming, and the likelihood of the "when" on it all. And sure enough he did do so. Both YD and her b'friend are out of town ..