Always is when I go away for the weekend with my family...
You can guarantee when I come back he's "been ill". EVERY TIME. So I phoned him - first sentence "I've been ill". Like its my fault because I went away!
STILL not taking all his medication that the GP gave him so I offer ZERO sympathy. Basically, wants me to tell him how he can feel better - "Take the meds the GP has given you Dad, if that fails then go an see you're GP but I'm not a doctor."
His words - "I desperately need you to visit the weekend." "I've got no food in the house" (Brother lives literally 5 mins drive from him - I live 35-40 mins. Brother is probably laying low). Anyway, he knows my car is in the garage so I'm struggling for transport and he knows my wife works weekends so may need our other car. So I tell him I can't promise. Anyone would have thought I'd told him I'd murdered the family next door.
Apparently, I'm "letting him down" and "need to arrange something", and "wife needs to understand". Of course the standby offer of home delivery groceries is not good enough - he doesn't want to spend the £30 minimum - they have to be hand delivered by me!
I've tried setting boundaries, I've said no can do, I've tried ignoring, I've tried just not doing. Give him his due he's relentless in his quest to get me to do what he wants!
As for your dad, my guess is that he doesn't want your brother to spend any time and attention on the child, because that might mean less time and attention on him. It's all about HIM, remember? The granddaughter can disappear for all he cares.
To take on custody of 2 toddlers on your own as a man, in 1972 is a BIG BIG step to take. I just don't think Dad has got it in him or ever did. This is the man who would never get a washing machine because "its too complicated" and "its womens work". Dad has spent his life assuming he can;t do something without finding out first I just don't see him making this huge jump without being forced into it to be honest.
As his "advice" to my brother shows his attitude is and always has been "work first, family can take a back seat". (personally, work comes about no 10 on my list below the cat!)
But aware that things may be skewed from my aunties point of view. Mother is still alive. Not seen her much. Shes not blameless. Hardly saw her for years and years. Shes just not part of my life.
Know what you mean though - I just want to know though.
Awful for my niece. My wife wants to take her on - bless her. BUT it'd be too much for us to be honest, and, secondly, it'd give my brother an easy out. I'm hoping he will still wise up.
Lets just say his new wifes attitude makes me dislike her even more. Shes told my Dad she can't possibly help because she works. Shes self employed decorator so she could manage her own hours surely. Of course, I see her on facebook. I'd estimate 2-3 days per month work, rest lunching with friends or sleeping.
Maybe a nice foster family will be better for her. My family are unbelievable. How on earth can you refuse to take on your own kid because "its inconvenient with work"?
I did point out to my Dad that how on earth does he think everyone else manages? i.e. us. One of you works child-friendly hours, or you have after school clubs, or pay for childminders. I nearly exploded when Dad said "yes but he can't afford to pay for that". Typical short sighted narrow minded Dad.
I'm just so annoyed with the pair of them - at the moment I want nothing to do with them. I know its my brother kids not mine but, recently, we just seem at polar opposites with our outlook on life. They're in the gutter to be honest. I still can't believe they both think its ok......
I know she did live with her gran for a bit but, apparently, something has happened between the gran and her mother and her gran has had enough. Probably not stopped her drinking to be honest.
I would help but it would be tough for us to be honest. To be honest we struggle now with out autistic teenager, 5 year old and my wife's illness.
Also, I'm still hopeful my brother will step up. Hes like my Dad if he can get someone else to do it for him he will. If I step in, then he'll just continue on as he is and think great problem solved.
Oh yes, my brother should never have children. As I said, he's got two more he never sees. Not bothered AT ALL. He posts on facebook now and again Woe is me I don't see my kids. I offered to help once - found out you can get a court order to force mother to reveal whereabouts. Cost was £200 ($250) - told him he said "nah not paying that". Now I don't bother. Kids are disposable to him - he leaves them with mother and moves on to next woman.
You might be spot on about my Dad though. He thinks of my kids as a "hindrance". To be honest, with everything, I can see it all coming to a head to be honest. Hes getting worse and worse, pushing more and more. Yes I'm trying to take on board the advice on here but I'm finding I want less and less to do with him.
As for my brother, I've never thought much of him. After this, I really dont want someone like this in my life at all.
If you were in therapy and you told your story, your therapist would ask "how do you know that?" "what makes you think that that's true?" and "I wonder what your other parent would say about that version of the facts?".
Go into this with an attitude of naive, evenly-hovering inquiry, not a quest for dirt or blame.
The stirring up will happen within you. Make sure you are ready for it.
But I'm getting to the point where I do sort of KNOW that there is something else to the whole story. There just has to be based on the way he sees the world to be honest.
At the moment, Dad, I think, relies a lot on this "well I brought you up on my own when you were little so you owe me". He hasn't said it outright but I can tell. (Brother has said this MANY times!).
I try not to feel guilty but I do when I push him away at the moment. If I had confirmation that hes not exactly been truthful all these years then it would help me to put things into perspective.
Would it ruin our relationship? Probably. But its been ruined anyway last few years to be honest, as its become more and more apparent of how he thinks and what he will do.
A guess for what it’s worth – your father was a pain in the but, and your mother found someone else who was more attractive. He tried to blackmail her by keeping the kids, and then learned to love the adulation he got for being such a great father. Perhaps other women rushed to help. Your mother has always felt guilty about what happened. My suggestion is that if you do contact her, offer her some sympathy and ask for some yourself. It would be a good way to try to get to know her, better than just asking questions. Learning the other side of family stories is always interesting, if upsetting, but finding a mother is more important, probably for both of you. And it’s a practical way to make at least some change in a situation that goes on and on and on for you.
Best wishes, Margaret
It was my little girls bday party on sunday - dad knew this. I'm at the ice rink 745am every sunday for training (shes well into ice skating) This week we'd tagged her party onto the so pretty much all day I was there.
10am Dads ringing. Always a bad sign when he rings early in the day.
"Are you coming up to see me today, I want to go out for a ride in the car?". "No dad".
"Why not? I want to go out I've been stuck in all week". (No he hasn't I've seen pics of him out to lunch with my brother 2 days ago).
"No I'm busy".
"You're at her party aren't you?"
"Yes dad". (So he does remember that I've got something on today. Annoys me how he refers to my kids, his grandchildren!!!).
"Well, I tell you what, let you're wife deal with that and you can come to see me". (What a thing to say - I've got to miss my own 6 year old daughters party because he demands a visit. Also, my wife (the devil) now has no name it seems).
"No Dad. Did you see the cricket score the other day?" (Changing the subject seems to work - yay !!!!)
Doing OK. Not so wound up as before. I'm getting my head around it a bit. I've come to realise that even though hes my Dad, and I love him, he is actually a complete a@hole. So I'm not making excuses anymore - it is what it is and if he doesnt like the deal....
Still didnt stop him speaking to my dear brother who a few hours later text me with his opinion on how I should take him out like he does as well.. Ignored that completely. I'll block his number if he carries on...
How was the party? Are you still deaf??? [remembering the pitch and volume of excited six year old girls in an enclosed space]
Dad is not happy. Rang me again today at 10am (I'm in work can't it wait?).....
Just to remind me that its Fathers Day next sunday and I really ought to visit him.....
Jeez. I planned to anyway but to be told whats "expected" of me really gets my goat....
You stood your ground and didn't budge.
You kept it on your terms.
You stayed calm and didn't argue with him.
You didn't give explanations or justifications for why you couldn't comply.
You distracted him by changing the subject.
You realized dad is an _ss,
You ignored enabling brother's call.
Most important, you got your priorities straight. You were there for your daughter and wife. You're a good dad and husband.
Ten points for each category. ;D
p.s. My daughter was also into ice skating a few years ago. Now she's into gymnastics and contortion and dance. Next year, she wants to take up acrobatics. Those classes aren't cheap. My husband said the reason he cried when the kids were born was because he knew his money was leaving his wallet. Haha.
To be honest, the conversation we had about my brother and kids sort of made me realise. He's my Dad but we're different people and he is an A@se. If he doesn't like the way I do things he can do one....
Yes she does ice hockey as well. Even more expensive!!!! (bought a lot of that stuff 2nd hand though).
I'm sorry I'm not willing to tell a 6 year old they can't do something I'd promised to do with them just because my Dad decides he wants someone to boss around. 90% of the time its this to be honest with him.
I've also decided I'm not running around doing pointless things just because he likes it that way.
No more unnecessary shopping trips (which is you remember are over an hour round trip drive for me) unless I'm going there anyway. If its an emergency he can accept delivery or starve....
Same with the health thing. He listens to the health professionals and what they advise him. If he won't listen then its not my job to sort it out. If he moans then I'm not getting involved.
Hardest one for me. I am NOT getting into conversations about my life. For too long he's had this idea that he can have an opinion on EVERYTHING, my relationship, my kids, my finances. No more. He'll be getting one warning to mind his own business then I'll be leaving/putting the phone down.
If brother says dad told me you did this -- dont dignify it with an answer. It just draws you back in to the whole narc guilt and gaslighting. Trying to explaine/convince what really happened. NO!!!! Just say I wont dignify that with an answer. You know dad. Then walk away. Let brother think what he wants. Hes not you judge or jury. He doesnt get to judge your actions. It prob wouldnt end in your favor anyway. Just add another layer of guilt. Thats his way of manipulation.
If you stock the pantry whats dad going to do? Throw all the food out? Doubtful. Grumble? Definitely, but just say you start that, and I walk out. Then do it.
Your not being mean. Your establishing NORMAL boundries that have been ignored for decades. If he throws a tantrum walk away. Your the adult and hes the child throwing a tantrum. You wouldnt tolerate being emotionally blackmailed by your child. Hes no different.
Sure it will guilt you, but its a muscle that hasnt been exercised in a long time. It gets easier as time goes on. You can even say I love you, but Im not doing that. Good job!!! 👍👍👍🏅
NO is a complete sentence. Then remind yourself to be silent after saying no. That way your not caught off guard. Also remind yourself to give him 1 warning. Im hanging up now when he or brother says something rediculious. Also remember when his antics dont work he gets brother to manipulate for him.
Screen calls. They need to leave message. Dont return call without knowing what they want. Put it off till when its convenient FOR YOU. Your still jumping thru hoops via answering the phone. Stop that. Good luck
She might not have had $ to take him to court to fight for custody. Might not have had $ to get an apartment, let alone pay for food for kids. Maybe she thought he had more $ to care for you. Or he told her she'll never get/see the kids. Can only leave with shirt on your back? Cant get alimony if in another country. Harder to get child custody.
She might have thought yor dad would turn you against her. Hes a narc. Do you think a narc would leave no stone unturned to win?
I think now women can go to a lawyer if they need help. A sliding scale. Probably wasnt resources for her to turn to, as there are today.
Worth it to hear the aunt's side of story.
Probably if he just limited his behaviour I'd be silly enough to let him get away with it.
I hear what you're saying, of course, I don't know the full story. She has family in the UK so could have come home at the same time but, apparently, did not want to.
But I can't see my Dad doing all of this willingly - at some point he would have been made to do this somehow. This was 1972 - not the the thing to be a single dad in those days.... I can tell you now first thing in Dad mind would have been - "Its not right a man bringing up kids".
This is the guy who won't use a washing machine because "its womens work", thinks it inappropriate to share a house with someone of the opposite sex (i.e. house mate) etc. This is the guy who last week, advised my brother his daughter would have to go into care because "you can't help look after her you've got work".
Taking on parental responsibility - I'd put my house on him not doing that willingly.
He deffo didn't wash our clothes (remember his attitude to washing machines). He'd fill a suitcase, walk a mile or so with us on a sunday over to his mothers (my grans) who'd do all the washing then he'd carry it home.
He got your clothes seen to - he did walk round to his mum's after all, instead of down to the pub or the club. He presumably opened a can of beans nightly and put fish fingers under the grill. Day in, day out. If nowadays he thinks anybody must be a mug to volunteer for this, are you going to tell him he's wrong?
Or would it have been better if he'd had you taken into care?
In a way, the more slapdash the job he made of parenting, the more credit it is to you that you've left it behind and - even more important - broken the pattern.
But speaking of patterns. If he ploughed on grudgingly with a job only because it was too painful and difficult for him to say no... Who does that remind you of?!
I still don't understand how he tells my brother not to do it and to put his own child into care now though. Its a whole lot easier now and brother has a partner to help him.
I just think he was given no choice at all back then, thats all.
Not necessarily with a good grace! And not necessarily as World's Best Dad. But nobody would even have been *surprised* if he'd said sod this and bolted.
With your poor little niece, there is an argument that the care system - sheesh - might be a better bet for her. At its best, it could give her security and stability much better than she's had so far; and it's got to be preferable to landing her in a household where she's overtly unwanted. It just crosses my mind to wonder if your Dad wonders, ever, if it might have been better all round for all of you, too. Maybe he doesn't think he made much of a job of it.
Try telling him that 'good enough' is good enough, some time.
But I know what you mean! Hes no way the world worst Dad of course hes not.
Know what you mean about my niece. I was wondering that too to be honest....
Nah don't think Dad thinks that. Hes is honestly just doing his usual attitude to kids.
He had his good points when I was a kid. Not for lack of effort at times with my Dad he was good but, looking back, he was just so stubborn and set in his ways. Heart was in the right place.
One thing he always pushed me in school. So to be fair, I went from rough council estate, rubbish high school, to degree, to running my own successful business...
BUT I have had my own "issues" over the years with things like depression/anxiety. I do always wonder how things when I was a kid have affected me.
A nac is a narc is a narc
Of course that did cross my mind. Hes since told me hes "disappointed" I didn't take him out last weekend. I do wonder if hes thinking - hang on if 2nd son takes on his own kids thats another son who might be deflected from focusing on him 100%.