Entitled aging parent. Any advice?

Hello,
I really feel that I need to weigh in on this predicament because it hits so close to home for me. I am a 68 year old single never married woman who has had two narcissistic parents. So I definitely understand your “please everyone” mentality because that’s what I’ve been doing for the past seven years. My mother has passed and I just learned that my dad has six months to live. He is 97 and thankfully is just an old man now, not a manipulative bone in his tired body and I love him dearly.

I am retired. I retired at 65 early because had I not the workplace would’ve driven me to a nervous breakdown. I kind of have to take issue about retirement goals not being met by your father or your mother, in that we were not fortunate enough to have 401(k)s until we were in our 40s and even then a lot of companies did not supply it. You are in a much better position regarding finances and retirement than your parents ever had the opportunity to have. Also, Social Security as a general rule will pay 1/3 of what you’used to make and for anyone regardless of their income level that is a huge adjustment, it took me an entire year to re-do my budget and figure out a sustainable way to live off of such a low income even with my savings.. I am fortunate that I have my own home, and I am very healthy, but my mortgage is not paid off. Anyway, I feel you are being overly critical of your mom because she truly does not have any money to pay for a house. That’s outrageous and the notion that she can go back to work, and earn a high paying living is outrageous as well. That will not happen , no one is going to hire her and certainly not at a really high rate of pay if she is lucky to land something.

All that said, I know that you are a good daughter and you have done more than your share of what your sisters have done and that needs to be addressed and good luck on that because generally, it’s just one child does all the work so I commend you for all the care you have given your mother, and I understand you have a family and a life and other things to do with your time than care for your narcissistic mother, who is ugly to you. I get it. However, maybe she can rent an apartment or move in with a friend of hers and they can share the rent or she can look online and try to see if she can rent out a room in somebody’s home that they need extra income something along those lines otherwise I’m afraid she’s going to be homeless, literally homeless. Especially in our times right now when everything is so high all the groceries have gone up and utility bills have gone up. My HOA fees have skyrocketed and I feel that I am in a pretty secure spot but in reality who knows I mean it’s really frightening when you are alone and you are retired and you have a limited income. Please place yourself in that scenario and then I think you would understand where your mom is coming from . I would urge you to help her find an alternative living arrangement that will work within her budget of Social Security, and it will not be what she is used to living. I don’t know what part of the country you live in and hopefully it is not a high dollar state , but I would urge you to help her find somewhere to live before you move. I can see why she’s totally paralyzed by the situation because it is overwhelming and I’m not even a narcissist.

what original arrangement was made when you moved mom/step dad in? Did they have no choice financially? How long were they there? When did he pass? How long has she been alone?

How far is she(the house) from you ? How far away are YOU moving?

do you know details of her finances?

without details my gut reaction is no, don’t expect her to back to work at 69. How close is she to the people she gives care?

uprooting her, again, from her “home” and friends/community is understandably upsetting.

YOU need to make plans, alternatives -more than one- and discuss.

Telling her hey, you’re out there n a year seems unkind. You painted yourself in a helper corner, tat sucks. But mom doesn’t get 100% of the blame her

Help her. Boundaries are fine, great actually. But you need to help at least a little.

I can give you advice based on what I saw my Aunt do for my grandmother when I was a teenager. When my grandmother - who had never worked outside the home, never drove a car - needed to move, my mother's sister and husband bought the house next door to them and made the payments. They moved my grandmother into it with my uncle who had Muscular Dystrophy and was not able to work any longer. My Aunt and Uncle did not charge any rent or hold anything over their heads. They never carried on about it - they just quietly provided my grandmother and uncle a safe place to live.

That showed me what LOVE is. When we give to others without expecting anything in return, that is LOVE.

I could never turn my mother out because I judged her to be capable and/or a burden. My belief is that if I refuse to help my family, then what good am I?

Peace.

Southibella, I am going to point out to you that the world has changed dramatically since you were a teenager. Most women of my generation (I'm about to be 70) expected to work and support themselves and planned for their own retirements.

We reared our children with the expectation that we would not need to be supported in our old age. My parents (born in 1923) also supported their elderly parents. There was resentment and lack of resources for the NEXT generation, not a good thing.

I understand the OP's position; yes, her parent must be scared, but needs to adjust her expectations.

Hi.
You have identified the " co- dependent, enabling" relationship.
What makes you think that this will end simply and with no grief?

Your mother is grieving the change. All senior citizens grieve when they have to leave their home for health, financial or other reasons associated with aging. Grief= shock, anger, denial, bargaining over and over and over ,even when one thinks acceptance has been reached. This is a " death".

You have reached your decision. Your mother has not. You are both on different paths.

At minimum,respect her dignity and grief. Seek and acquire support for her and yourself so that this
" divorce " and " death" of a long term relationship arrangement can end as congenial and appropriate as possible.

Her and or your local faith clergy should be contacted to support you both. Arrange for an appropriate Senior Services professional or other social services are invited to assist her with assessing her financial and emotional needs for safe housing and a safe transition. Subsidized senior housing may be one option .

Move forward as you have decided is appropriate for you but with kindness and understanding that her grief , denial, resistance, and fear of the unknown are natural .

Seek emotional and spiritual support for yourself also.

Without rushing,the sooner the transition evolves, the better so that healing and restoration and new beginnings can begin for you both.

"She wants to make absolutely no concessions in her lifestyle. We considered having her move in with us, but I don’t think that would be good for any of us."

OH NO. DON'T DO THIS.

"The people pleaser in me just wants to give in".

NO NO DON'T DO THIS EITHER. Hang in there and hold your ground !

1. Put yourself/family first.
2. Sell the house.
3. She'll b - - t c h and complain. Expect it and have self-affirmations ready in your head "I am a good person... I've done all I can... she can work if she wants to."

4. Do not doubt yourself.

5. Come here for our pep talks.

6. She is making her own decisions and will need to live with them. She appears to need someone (that would be YOU) to vent her anger towards . . . walk away.

7. Yes, good for your sisters supporting you to be more independent and separate from your mom. It is time to cut that umbilical cord. I know it is not easy to make these decisions. However, your mother sounds narcissistic and needs to learn that she is responsible for herself, not you.

8. Thank you for reaching out to us. We are here for you.

Gena / Touch Matters

Fholmes: Do not have her move in with you.

My sincerest Apologies!
I do not see anything about your mother's medical conditions to not work, but I now see why she wants a break after losing her last job to Covid. Age 69 does need a break. If she had worked for at least 10 years, she can get full SSA benefits, but not yet maximum benefits, because she is one year short of age 70. If did not work 10 years, apply for SSI benefits. Medicare is still a 2-year wait.

Look, the crazy, XXXX federal government looks at age 69 as very, very young. They are just very stingy because they do not want to pay!! However, many people are just too unhealthy even to wait until age 62, let alone full benefits at ages 66 to 67, or to maximum age 70 (FRA) Social Security benefits age. Timing starts at the earliest age for minimum benefits at age 62 to the maximum benefits at age 70. However, please decide carefully before collecting benefits, because once claimed, the chosen monthly benefits, the larger or lessor, are permanent for life.

Unfortunately today, it is very difficult to find decent work because employers are no longer friendly and have just one interest: to make profits for their businesses and blame the economy to cut their help. If anyone is lucky to find work, the stress can make an employee quit, anyhow!

Back before 1983, I thought I was going to retire at age 65, but the federal government revised their budget to make us all work longer, up to age 67, according to the year of birth. I had worked over 40 years but never, ever earned a pension since job changes happened about every 8 to 10 years. I lost a good job over ten years ago in 2012 after 25 years of service, short of 30 for better money, then two years ago in 2020 after nearly 5 years of service from Covid, and I had to pay Medicare Part B for 14 months before I started FRA Social Security instead of using my last employer's coverage until planned FRA started, reducing the savings I wanted for some of my retirement. I had to work another 14 months to age 66- and two-months for my FRA last year! I could have worked a little longer but decided to not because of some health conditions that required time off for several appointments that would have taken way too much of my time away from work.

I am very happy to be home and now better off, even with less income than I had planned from jobs that went away because of the economy and pandemic. Unfortunately, I then had to pay more for dental work in 2021 with Kaiser Medicare Advantage Senior Plus instead of getting better coverage with my former permanent employer of 2020.

More apologies last stated. Medicare starts at age 65, so your mother got Medicare Part B after losing her job. Contact the County in her area for assistance instead of leaving her go homeless.

Is this post real? You haven't mentioned any actual reasons you can't abide, nor mentioned how your spouse feels. Anyhow...

Ummmmm you have NO plan. You have sold your soul to the idea of her stepping up into near full time employment again. You are trying to control her for the fun of it!

You aren't being realistic. You can't go from top of the line service to her, to bottom of the barrel abandoning her, without a financial transition. I even wonder if you are selling just to get rid of her! Your motives are really questionable here. It's one thing to recover from a dysfunctional family but another thing entirely to overreact late in life. How in the world do you think "we can get past this" when you have NO plan for her shelter! She's not going to "get past this" if she's homeless. She has retired, which for most people is a final and complicated decision (except for some part time work). But it takes a full time income to afford housing nowadays. You have stricken fear of not surviving in her heart. She probably can't even think and probably worries 24/7 about how she is going to find shelter.

Ummmmm she is a retired widow who cannot afford housing. Presumably once she retired (for official purposes), she can't just pick up gainful employment again or she'll mess up her SS income and health insurance. Your idea of her buying a home is nuts - she wouldn't even have a down payment even if she worked full time for 6 months. Does she even have enough good credit to qualify for a mortgage?

Ummmmm you say you are codependent, enabling, a rock... but you're acting with wanton abandonment. You need to get her on all of the wait lists for the:
Local City Housing Authority low-income housing and Section 8
Nearby Cities Housing Authorities low-income housing and Section 8
Distant Cities Housing Authorities where she has loved ones low-income housing and Section 8
Distant Counties Housing Authorities where she has loved ones low-income housing and Section 8
Local County Housing Authority low-income housing and Section 8
Food Stamps
Introduce her to food banks
Get her a Social Worker
Get her on welfare: State Cash Assistance to the Blind, Disabled and Aged which leads to other housing possibilities through their department.
Encourage her to meet men and re-marry
Encourage her to make friends who could be housemates or apartment-mates
Supervise her and shepard her through Craigslist and other sites, senior sites, to find housemates safely by meeting in public first a couple times

You haven't mentioned one reason why you and she cannot abide, other than your opinion that this widow should be on her own. Is there some reason family can't stay together? Does she break rules, fight, fail to clean up after herself, bring strangers home, make noise at night, fail to pay her portion of rent, steal? Do you want more privacy? Maybe a mother-in-law unit would be better. You have the power to raise her rent, thus forcing her into part time work or welfare in order to compensate. You can get your money - although you might have to evict her if she doesn't come up with it. But to leave her homeless...

Why are you charging your mother rent? Is that even a thing? In the SOUTH??Without a doubt, 3 can live as cheaply as 2.

Who is "we"?

Why are you moving?

What "other arrangements" can she find when all her money goes to you! First, last and deposits are about $3000 where I live. She can't save up for that if you are charging her rent. You say you offered to pay for counseling but that is so high and mighty of you! So you are a psychologist now!

Do not have her move in with you.

Look at the Dept of Aging for assistance. Your mother should have Social Security and Medicare. There should be subsidized housing for seniors she could qualify for where she would be happy to live. Independence from you for your mother and for you is the key. It reminds me of a chant my mother used to almost sing with a French lilt of the word “Independence.”

Your mother would be with her peers. Going back to work would be a stretch at this point.

I understand why you are moving. It is for tax purposes, to reduce your footprint, to eliminate your mother’s dependence on you and to move on to the next chapter of your life with your family.

Your mother didn’t plan, didn’t think about the future and now sees everything going up in smoke. A redirect through a different means like a subsidized apartment, which may be a lot smaller than she is used to having, but a lot less work, allowing her more social interaction, would be the best.

You are correct by saying that it isn’t a good idea to allow her to move in with you. Parents living with children changes everyone’s lives and usually not for the better.

I hope your mom is able to find work soon.

There are senior citizens apartments with lower rent that are available. They charge accordingly to a person’s income. My cousin lives in one of these. She likes it. They provide a shuttle bus to the store, doctors and pharmacies.

She should start looking immediately because there is usually a wait list.

Best wishes to you and your family.

As some of our forum had said earlier, her mother is age 69 and may not find suitable work, no matter how hard she tries. Employers are just not hiring any applicants for work previously regarded as suitable. She had decided to retire, and no one can force more stress into her. She desperately needs a break and help from her county for additional welfare assistance.

By the way, I am now 67 with some health conditions, the newest being contact dermatitis and now require skin patching for possible allergies that will take 3 me to conscecutive appointments no employer may appreciate my absence. And no suitable work to accommodate me exists anymore. I feel I have outlived work myself and got a break from difficult job responsibilities for just minimum wage.

Hello, I'm back to share more:

I'm going to share the facts about my last job with a recycled items store doing processing in the back and rolling racks of items presented for sale. Those tasks I loved doing. I started working there in February 2021. The day I had started work, I was assigned to clean their breakrooms and bathrooms, yes, the men's as well, because the store left the janitorial service go due to Covid in 2020. That assignment was rotating weekly with all staff, so I worked it an average of 20 minutes daily that week assigned in addition to our regular duties. Later, like August into early September 2021, several employees quit when told to work a sixth day for OT. So, I ended up with cleaning twice a month with reduced staff.

Where was the safety practice for Covid? God only knows! I did not get my original series vaccination until April 2021, so lucky I survived Covid since I still had to earn money. I turned 66 in September and was happy to quit and retire from that place. So, I don't trust any more employers since its likely they all want to cut their friggin expenses. They will do anything they want and make us employees fill in to do the dirty work to save their business a few bucks.

This is why independent and assisted living has become so popular, along with senior living communities and apartments.

I do not understand why people continue to think that the younger generation are supposed to be clones of ‘The Waltons’ television show. They could resolve their issues by the end of the episode. That isn’t how it works in real life! The problems go on for years.

I should know! I allowed my mom to live with me for over a decade. It’s hard! I find that a lot of people who recommend that others take in their parents have never walked in their shoes. Swap places and see how difficult it is.

Never in a million years will I do this to my daughters. They deserve lives of their own without an aging parent living with them.

Renting or leasing out a place requires a contract for perhaps two years. Forms are filed with either a renting agency, online or in person and require ID to set up. Income and Credit is also verified.

As a 71 yr old female I can not fathom such nonsense. I would never burden my only child..a daughter. I am healthy . I found a wonderful HUD apartment when I retired and I take care of all my 89 yr old mothers needs. I expect my daughter to enjoy her life, work and call once in awhile! This is a tough problem…never move her into your house!!!!! Find a good HUD apartment and help her move. P.S. We teach people how to treat us…now you must have her unlearn a lifetime of manipulation…Good Luck.

I am going to share this once again: it is illegal to kick anyone out of a shelter, including your mom. She is facing a crisis and emergency for shelter. She can go to the office of aging to see a social worker and explain that she may be facing homelessness and go from there. If no replacement shelter can be found at the time, the State social worker may even step in and place her in foster care or some other transitional living place until permanent housing can be found for her welfare.

Once out of a shelter, NO SENIOR is going to be left to live on the street without shelter. I think APS is going to place her into some transitional housing until permanent housing gets found.

A few ideas:

Would you be able to continue the current arrangement until after you move? Wouldn’t that relieve a lot of your stress for the time being?

I understand that your concern is she will run out of money to pay you even that. Soooooo…….

then, perhaps some time after you move and settle in, would you consider selling the home she lives in, taking half that amount and perhaps buying her a smaller home or apartment?

That way, she won’t have to pay rent, so you won’t have to worry about her running through what little money she’s got, and you will still have half the money from the sale, plus you’ll save on some real estate taxes with the new purchase, which will continue gaining value for sale in the future.

Just a thought. The idea is to try and keep the stress and grief at bay while having a practical financial solution.

also, you won’t be “kicking her out.” ;)

hope that helps.

It depends on the family's financial situation. Real estate is illiquid at the time, not a bank ATM to draw funds from unless pulling money out from an equity credit. How long was this house owned? It costs commission fees, hiring movers and other moving -related costs besides relocation costs and new location arrangements. If the home was not owned very long, say less than five years, it's selling costs barely breaks even and may even suffer loss instead of gaining a profit. This is real estate and meant to be a long-term purchase to live in.

Real estate is just not like a cash acount at a bank where one can transfer funds to a new account In a new location, then close the former account. I've worked in banking for over 30 years with accounting experience.

So, can't your mother go to the county to work out some alternate housing arrangements until she is stabilized, then you can even lease out with tenants Iiving in the house with an option to buy until your house does get sold??

Yes sadly she is taking advantage of a good situation you kindly gave her and now is the bully to keep it.
That is immature. You have her enough time. Making a firm stand is hard. Up to now her bullying and talking bought her time. Face some tears and move and I wonder if she will surprise you and be ok because then she has to rely on herself
good luck

it's just really inhumane to toss someone out of the shelter without an eviction notice if unable to pay. I pray for only the best for you and your mother.

This woman has been given a year to find herself an apartment. She is not being kicked out. She has been given a fair and more than adequate amount of time to find other housing. She simply does not want to move to an apartment or smaller dwelling. The OP has been more than fair.

You are doing the right things. The problem is the fact that your Mom doesn't want to change. She's content/happy with the way things are and now things are going to change. She cannot see how the future is going to work for her. She doesn't have to pay for her housing so all her social security and cash can go to the "good" things in life.

If she doesn't get a job, would she qualify for Medicaid with her Social Security income? Is there a way that she can afford housing and essentials without going back to work?

She is 69, well past what people consider retirement age. Help her to move on in a way that does not require her to have a job. She is going to call you all kinds of names in the book. Unfortunately, that is the way some people are.

Don't change your plans. Help her with planning her future.

Find a counsellor that can advise your mom - and you - about her financial needs. Start by asking about a financial planner at the bank. Gather information about your mom's financial needs and her current spending habits. Bring this to the financial planner to line out options. If a financial planner isn't available, book an appointment with a counsellor that deals with elders and finances. AARP might be able to point you to a counsellor. You are not obligated to bankroll your mother's "retirement," but she will probably respond better to options outlined by an authority figure she respects. Change isn't easy and "going back to work" probably is scary for her. She will need your encouragement to make the necessary changes.

You charged your own mom to live with you in your house? It's your mom and you should take full responsibility of her at that age. She's 70 and it's time for you to take care of her.

What did you do with the monies she's paid you for rent over the years? Was that applied to meet the mortgage?

Could you calculate the amount of rent she's paid to you over the years and return that to her when you sell the house? That would provide her with a nest egg.