Stuck with mother in law... the saga continues. Could the doctor be wrong?
I posted back in February and then in April about my 78-year-old MIL moving with us out of state. My last posts have more detail that would be impossible to reiterate here, but bottom line is she was supposed to come stay with us as an independent roommate, but the week she got here she admitted that she lied about her income and needed us to essentially take care of her financially. After several months of paying all her bills, I nipped this in the bud — I began enforcing the original agreement that she was to pay $500 towards rent, and after months of paying her car insurance, medications, groceries, phone bill, etc I began flat out refusing. I told her she needed to get a job or figure something else out but that we would no longer be paying her way. She resisted very dramatically, acting as if we were forcing her to go without her medications and food, and allowing her car insurance to lapse so she could lament that WE “let it go unpaid,” and telling a neighbor that we refused to pay to fix her flat tire so that the neighbors chipped in and bought her a tire (😳), but I firmly kept telling her that she is a grown up and must pay her own way because we are still a young family and our responsibility is to our young child, not her.
Finally, after many weeks of my taking this tact, she got a small part time job in retail up the street. She now has her own money but still refuses to buy her own groceries and if I refuse to include her in all our meals (which was getting very expensive), she’ll act like we are abusing her and start saying that the doctor is concerned she’s losing weight or may be diabetic. It's all manipulation, and it's caused a lot of grief in my otherwise-perfect marriage because I finally began refusing to reward this behavior (my husband still allows himself to be manipulated by her and guilt-tripped —he always has).
After several really crazy incidents (her speaking badly about me daily to my 9 year old daughter, treating our daughter badly when shes angry at me, pretending to “break down” on the highway and making my husband leave a business meeting to go retrieve her to make him feel guilty for telling her we would no longer be driving her everywhere and running all her errands since she insists on keeping her $500/month car payment, and $200/month insurance, catching her in repeated lies), we told her this is not working and she needs to find her own place ASAP. However, she has refused to do so, and it has become clear to us that if we want her out, WE must find the place and WE must pay the security deposit and WE must move her. She no longer speaks to me, making my home so tense I can hardly bear it.
Anyway, here’s my question: when she first moved in, I took her to several doctors appointments to have her tested for dementia. The doctor says she does not show any dementia, just normal aging. However, her behavior is so bizarre we feel he has to be wrong. Aside from the constant lying and refusal to do anything for herself and all the daily manipulation, (I know this sounds really crazy) we think she has been cutting our clothes. When we told her we expect her to help out around the house, we began finding bleach stains and clear scissor cuts in our clothes. Last week, I left my phone on the counter and when I came back in the house, it was gone. We searched for hours, and after I mentioned I was going to try to GPS locate it in the house, it suddenly appeared in a place I already checked a several times. I found out yesterday she had “accidentally” told her doctor’s office to put all her copays on MY HSA card, draining my health account of over $300. What is my next move? Should I have her re-evaluated? Maybe she needs assisted care?
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Typical dementia, or ALZ will appears as memory problems but there are other types like Frontaltemporal lobe dementia & Lewy Body Disease that present differently. Could be more like a psychiatric problem - dependant personality, even narcisstic? Has she always been manipulative? Needs a professional to eval.
Wow. In a bad way wow. And your poor family needs her to move out asap. How to get a Social Worker on the case. Surely you have rights to evict her if it comes to that?
I have called the Agency on Aging in our county. It took literally a month for someone to get back to me and the lady was very monotone and told us the best she could do is to get her in for a Needs Assessment but that she would have to agree to go. She said that since there’s no diagnosis and that the doctor doesn’t feel she has any issues, she wouldn’t be a priority. It was very much like “You are her family, you need to handle it.” There wasn’t a lot of sympathy... granted, I probably just sound like a bitter in-law.
Or you can take your daughter and leave. This woman has psychiatric issues that your HUSBAND needs to acknowledge.
He set this up. HE should solve it.
I just got in a huge argument with her bc she “accidentally” locked me out of the house in the rain and pretended she didn’t hear me knocking on the door for 10 minutes (my 9 year old was in her room with headphones on). When I finally climbed in a window, I hollered at her and said “Really? You didn’t hear me knocking?” Ten minutes later my daughter comes upstairs crying and says “Grandma says you want her out and that she only cake here because she wanted to be close to me and you’re treating her like a child and making her go live in her car.” I flew into her room and said I have had enough, that it is beyond sick to do that to a child and it is the one thing that will absolutely make me pack her bags TODAY and put them in the street. She left for work an hour early, no doubt so she can go in there and play her little old lady with the evil daughter in law act at work so someone will give her something or buy her lunch or something.
This is complete bedlam. I cannot allow my child to see this behavior. I cannot allow my household and my family to fall apart because of this woman.
Also, tell the Doctor what she has been doing out of spite. This is a mental thing.
I looked back at the previous posts. I suggested you look into Senior HUDD housing. They require 30% of her income for rent. She would be responsible for electric, TV and food. TV you can get a antenna so no cable cost. She can get food stamps. The car has to go. She can't afford it. Sr housing may have transportation for residents.
Why does she only receive $500 a month. Was she married before? How long? If over 10 yrs she is entitled to something of her exs. If a widow, calculations are based on his income too. When did she start collecting? If she has continued to work, she maybe entitled to more money. My GF just did this. Take her to ur local SS office. If its in with Social Services, then talk to them too. Since her SS is not that high, she may qualify for SSI, its like welfare.
Sorry, but it looks like you are going to have to do the work if u want her out. First, find that HUDD senior building. Put her name in now. Call the local Office of Aging and see what info they have.
I would whisper in her ear if she doesn't stop destroying ur clothing and anything else, you are going to have her declared mental and have her placed in a NH on meds. 😊
At 78 she is not going to be able to work forever. You have to do something now. Your new health problem could be aggravated by stress. Stress may have contributed to it.
Stick by ur guns. All u owe her is a roof over her head and food. The rest comes down to if she can't afford it, then she doesn't get it. If she wants a certain food that you don't eat, then she needs to buy it. She needs to give u money for it before u buy it.
I might tell the neighbors that you would have bought Mom the tire but she shouldn't be driving and a flat tire was a good excuse to keep her from driving. Play her game.
To clarify, she gets a $392 pension and $1,050 from social security, of which $240 is deducted for back taxes to the IRS and another $126 is deducted for Medicare. This leaves her with about $1,000 income. She absolutely refuses to get rid of her car, and the payment is $400-something. Her insurance is another $200. She was supposed to give us $500 rent, but that is obviously counterproductive since we then end up paying for everything else. She now has a little job, which should net her about another $800 a month. She is perfectly capable now of buying her own food, gas, medications, incidentals.
She was briefly married to a terrible man (not my husband’s father — in fact, she ran away from my husband’s real father when she was 8 months pregnant, went back to the loser boyfriend who had been in jail, named my husband after him, and subjected my husband as a child to this man’s abuse and lied and told him his real father didn’t want him... we found the real father when my husband was 32 and learned that was all a lie, but that’s another story). She has mismanaged her finances her whole life, saved nothing, has no assets or savings. And her stance is that it is my husband’s job to take care of her and support her financially in her old age. It’s madness.
No matter what you have to do down the road, having these records will help tremendously.
{{{Hugs}} to you, this is just a sucky situation and you seem to be bearing the brunt of it :(
Where I live, we call 000 for emergencies. If it's a mental health situation, a special crisis assesment team comes out. Off to hospital for eval if required. Not sure what criteria is though... acting dangerously psychotic is a long way from her current manipulative & anti-social behavior.
If there is ANY threat - could you involved the police/911? I realise you may not want the neighbours to witness this...
I think I would visit my local Police Station for advice & a chat. I'd warn I may have to call them as my house 'guest' has very anti-social behaviour & I am concerned for my daughter's safety.
I suggest a counselor for you & your husband. A complete outsider with training in the human psyche might be able to suggest ways to not only handle her, but get her out of your lives.
I'm so sorry you're having to live this.
Hang in there, praying for you!
Sorry I don’t have much advice but I really do hope you and your family can find a solution that works for all of you 🙂
I feel like this really should be your husband’s problem, but you may have to do the legwork of finding her a place. In my state waiting lists for decent senior housing are very long. Maybe you can find her a small apartment or even a room for her to rent while she’s waiting.
Your husband may well be good and kind, but he’s also kind of wimping out by allowing his mother to engage in behavior that makes his wife and daughter miserable. He’s a husband and father before he is a son.
Pleas check the laws in your State, or County before you toss belongings on the driveway. Same with changing the locks.
I suggest you take your daughter someplace safe for the summer and let him figure this out.
If she’s competent enough to commit fraud (and yes I’d call your credit card companies to contest the charges), vandalism (on your personal property) and verbal assault (on your child about you) she is plenty capable of handling her finances or lack thereof.
Its going to be hard for you but you need to make your husband choose!
He will do whatever it takes, what has he done?
I would tell my mom to treat my wife and daughter with respect in THEIR home or she could live in that car she is so attached to.
He is a coward when it comes to his mommy or she would have been gone or treating you and your daughter better.
Next time your daughter comes crying because grandma is evil enough to try to traumatize her, pack a bag and tell your husband you will be back when psycho b is gone.
I'm not an alarmist, but I have lived with a person who suffers from mental illness off his meds and things get scary. The energy in the home stays toxic and affects everyone. It is a very very unhealthy situation for everyone. Your child should not have to be around such behavior.
I hope you can get this toxic woman out of your home soon!!
Sounds like you have an unwanted guest that needs to be removed...
1. Do not pay her bills, any of them.
2. If she is eating with you, do not serve the food at the table. Put it on plates in the kitchen and everyone gets a plate. Everyone gets fed, and she cannot take larger servings leaving someone else without. If she wants more to eat she will have to buy her own snacks.
3. Your daughter is old enough for an explanation that grandma isn't always right in the head. Get books on how to explain this without scaring her or making her defensive for either of you. At her age she needs her family to love her and to feel secure.
4. You have a right to feel secure in your own home. If MIL interferes with this she goes. This isn't a debate, it is a basic need. MIL was able to manage before she lived with you and she can do that now. Husband needs to understand this.
5. Your husband has been abused by her his entire life. He is still trying to earn her love and respect. This will never happen. He needs help to accept this. It isn't his fault, she just isn't capable of normal relationships and never has been.
6. Does MIL have siblings or cousins that she likes? If so, send her there.
7. Do NOT make this between MIL and you. It isn't. It is between her and the world. You are just one of her victims.
8. If her "friends" want to help her or give her money let them. They will eventually see through her, so don't worry about what they think of you based on her whining.
9. Hide your money and valuables. Don't leave cash or credit cards where she might find them. Put jewelry in a safe deposit box.
10. Take pictures of the damage she does (cut up clothes). You may someday need them for legal purposes.
11. Let your extended family know what is happening. Don't complain, just spell it out factually. You may need their support now or in the future.
www.nami.org - look for a chapter near you and get information about how to manage family members with mental illness. You can't fix this and she doesn't want to fix it so don't try. Just do what you need to and get your safe, loving family back to normal.
At least with my mother, earlier dementia took some of her filters away so her basic personality disorder was more apparent but there were other signs ie she couldn’t keep track of her medication. We’d put them into pill holders weekly but she was sure we did it wrong(🙄) and we’d find stray pills all over the house. She’d pay bills over and over or send money to junk mail ie assumed an ad with any figure mentioned was a bill to pay. Her rants got much worse but there were other changes as well. Your MIL sounds like a mentally ill woman more than dementia.
i wouldn’t be too hard on your husband, his mother has groomed him his whole life to feel responsible for her , but I would insist he seek counseling. Or maybe go together. You don’t want to force him to choose , he needs to see the reality for himself.
Is there no way you can get a second opinion regarding your MIL having Dementia from another doctor.
You can't continue to live like that. As you say your a young couple and have a 9 year old daughter who is also suffering due to it
It's hard to know whether she's playing you both or if she has dementia. No matter which one it is i don't think you can continue to live this way. This will have an awful effect on your 9 year old daughter. When you MIL time comes and she passes away you don't want your daughters memories to be of a nasty granny.
It would surprise me that your MIL is being nasty i feel there is a medical reason. Good luck and i hope you get sorted soon. X
The only way I've ever found to deal with malignant narcissists is to put as much land mass between myself and them as possible. Your young family is your top priority in life, and you must not allow your MIL's presence to tear you guys apart.
My advice: Tell her that she has two weeks to find a suitable living arrangement (apartment, roommate, etc.) or you will install her in assisted living. Then make good on that threat--collect brochures for AL places and put them around the house, call facilities while she is watching and make appointments for tours, start stacking up boxes for her to pack her things. Chances are she will try to guilt you by pretending to get sick, or she might even "let up" on her narcissistic behaviour. Don't fall for it. Remain positive and firm. If she asks you why you want her to leave, simply say the current arrangement is not working. You owe her no more than that. If she doesn't find her own place after a few days of this, that first visit to the AL facility will probably do the trick. Do not give her any options--stand firm and do it for your family. Narcissists have a habit of living to a ripe old age, and you will never have any peace unless you put your foot down now.
My 92-year-old mother is a malignant narcissist, and I've been dealing with her toxicity for 56 years. The only way I can tolerate her is to live at least 1,000 miles away from her. I wish you all the best, and BE STRONG!