My father won't do ANYTHING to stop himself falling, and it's getting complicated. What do I say to him?

The falls are hard to watch. My dad had many, some with me right next to him while he was using a walker. There is no complete prevention. Give your dad the walker whether he will use it or not, just have it nearby without asking him to use it, don’t pick him up after the falls, call for help. He’ll eventually tire of waiting on the floor for help to come, or he’ll break something and be forced to use help. I’m sorry it’s coming to this but you can’t reason with him or adjust his reality. Seems he’s a guy that has to get it for himself.

Sounds to me there maybe some Dementia which is common with Parkinsons. Me, I am not beyond a little threat. "Dad if you don't stop trying to walk, I may have to put you in a Nursing Home and they will put u in a wheelchair".

Get rid of the canes. They do no good when both legs are effected. You need one good leg to help support the bad.

From what I have been told, when a person suffering from Parkinsons falls, they fall backwards. There are special walkers for them that help with this problem.

You can not do more to "make" him use a walker, use an emergency button.
All you can do is wait......
You wait until a fall puts him in the hospital then in rehab. (If he survives the fall) *hate to be blunt*

At that point he may be confined to a wheelchair and then you start all over again as he tries to get up from the wheelchair and falls out of it. (see above for scenario)

With Parkinson's balance is poor adding possible dementia to that mix makes it more difficult. Good possibility that he is not "getting" the cause and effect of what he is doing.

Just try to keep things as safe as possible. Keep areas open so there is nothing to trip on or over. Remove area rugs that he could trip on.

You can't - or rather *he* can't - adjust his sense of reality.

Sit back and wait for the bad one? - not exactly, but accept that it is inevitable, yes.

Meanwhile, you do what you can. Don't lecture him. Don't anybody lecture him! But when he's up and about and off on his travels (as I used to think of it) whoever is nearest pops up smiling alongside him and guides his balance. Have the people who are oftenest there been offered any training or advice on safe mobilising?

His reality seems to be totally different from the real world. You can not "force" him to be practical or safe. You could, as has been suggested, tell him the real possibility that continuing to attempt to walk without assistance could land him in a NH but ................ would he remember what you said an hour later? Possibly not. And BTW, there is no way to truly prevent falls from someone who thinks they can still walk even in NH. You and the family can only do so much.

If pride is a reason he ignores a cane or walker, would he use "walking sticks" like hikers use. They do not shout "disability" as loudly as canes and walkers.

Does he have a walker where he can sit on it incase he gets weak? Can you get someone that you all know and he does too that is using either a walking stick or a walker to tell him pride doesn't matter if you end up in bed or a wheelchair for the rest of your life? Take all the devices away put them up and if he asks tell him well you aren't using them I think I will donate them to someone who would but put them away just in case he needs one in the end. Does he have someone who he looks up too if so write a letter to that person and ask if they would help you in this matter. Talk to a therapist to see if there is anything you can say to him to use one. Also tell him that the stress of him falling is hurting you maybe putting it that way he will have some compassion for you and start just using them at home or around you.

Its hard for someone who has never used anything like this to start my brother in law carries his instead of using it. Maybe get your father checked for dementia he may have the start of it they have some drugs out there that can slow that progress down like my brother in law he has been on one now for 5 yrs it has slowed his down but soon it won't.

Ask God for some help he is there for us. Prayers that you find the right answer to your problem and your father starts using them.

This is really a losing battle. Could you have him assessed for a motorized wheelchair (some folks call them scooters). They want to feel they are still independent and I get the constant state of being on alert for a fall. It’s exhausting. It’s not if, it’s when he falls that it will cause him to be in a wheelchair. You might get his doctor to order PT and take him and let the expert assess him. They will observe him walking and can suggest what is safe etc. perhaps coming from someone other than family he might listen. But a physical assessment by a PT would be a very wise and good start for his safety.

Every one should LEAVE HIM ALONE! If your Dad has his mental faculties even tho his choices aren't what you think are good. Your Dad has the right to do as he pleases.
All ya'll can do is let him know ya'll are there for him to offer help.
He'll either accept the help or not, it's his choice.
He'll use his walker or accept the fact that when he doesn't he could fall.

When he falls bad enough to go to the Hospital or Rehab, maybe he'll decide to use his walker.

His Choice

I am beginning to experience the very same thing except my husband is not falling that often, yet. He has tripped stubbing his toes and bleeding all over but declares that is 'not a fell' but just a minor 'trip'. Yes, I have the same challenges with my husband being so very stubborn in complete denial he has any mental challenge. I do not know what to suggest at this point in time.

I had a horrible situation dealing with late mother who finally fell again and became incontinent anf unable to stand let a lone walk. This was going on for years with her walking unsteady with a cane and refusing a wheelchair or rollator with a seat. I was always calling the emts to get her up. She accused me of not being "encouraging" when i said a cane alone is not enough. Finally she fell again in April 2020 and was diagnosed with vascular dementia bedridden and incontinent. She got suckef into the for profit bs facilities until she died on home hospice. She left me myriads of problems she refused to address. I am overwhelmed and feel like my lost to the downsizing I want and but that she refused.

The aftermath of her death has left me with all responsibilites legal affairs and expresses. I have a probate lawyer and some sort of investment broker who is trying to get me to invest more.

I am sad and feel I don't know who to trust. I am overwhelmed by everything.

The aftermath of her death is worse than changing her diaper.

I feel I am in the dark anf don't know where to go for guidance.

I feel my own mother's lack of adequate planning and stubbornness is just about bumping me off. Where would you go for support and guidance dealing with all this? Seems like everyone is out for money. I am nesr drowning and life has lost all pleasure. I am 66 years old and am so angry with my narcissistic mother.

What do you say? you ask. You do what is necessary for his well-being. Period.
Clearly, you cannot handle the situation and he needs more support than you can provide.

You need to understand dementia. Do you realize you cannot talk logic and common sense to a person who's brain chemistry has / is changing and brain cells dying? You need to educate yourself on dementia.

I have no idea what your quoted 'rage against the dying of the light' "THING" ??? means.

Talk to his medical professionals.
Find a medical social worker.
Are you writing 'us' here instead of contacting his medical provider and if so, why?
If you do not take some actions on his behalf, you might be liable for abuse, allowing this to continue.

The 'granny' who posted below is wise; while we don't want to just let a loved one fall we do what we can to keep them safe. I learned from experience with my Mom that when an elder begins falling the lifespan is 6 months on average...and in her case it was true, same with my favorite uncle several years later. Sometimes humans 'know' their end is near and as hard as it is the best we can do is let them let Nature take its course, while making their environment as safe as possible.

He has asognosmia - the inability to recognize his true health issues. You can not convince him of his "falling problem" since he doesn't see it as a problem. You can only try to protect him.

A few nursing home techniques to try:
1 - Railings along hallways and grab bars in bathrooms near toilet and bath/shower.
2 - Shower chair and handheld shower for bathing.
3 - Chair/bed alarm (usually a pressure-sensitive pad) that makes noise when the person on it tries to get up.
4 - Bed in lowest position possible, no side tables to fall on.
5 - Thick mats on floor on side(s) of bed if falling out of bed is a problem.
6 - Line of sight. He must always be within sight or reach of a person when he is awake.

You know this post rings many bells. Dad started with the falls from day one after the hospital. First time it was getting out of his bed. I helped him get up/all on me that time (my efforts). The next time was dead-of-night and I just so happen to hear someone calling out. It was him in the middle of our living room floor. Well, he kept asking us to get him up, pick him up, one person after the other.

We told him what he needed to do so that he could help us get him up from the living room floor. He protested! I said, if I have to call the ambulance, they may take you back to the nursing home (not beyond little threats). He still protested saying he didn't give a *90.

So we walked away for a few and watched him on camera. Finally when we got back in the room, he listed to instructions (thankfully can follow some right now) and was able to use the sofa to help himself get back in the wheelchair with little assistance from us.

This is so hard because we have to keep watching them try and hoping for no injury. It is hard on them and for my dad because he was a very active man (from sunup to sundown) and for me I don't want to see him battered and bruised.

I tell him remember this old saying thrown in my face growing up. Hard head makes for a soft behind. Sometime he will laugh and then other times he gives us the whatever, you'll have too many house rules.

Falls are THE number one preventable cause of death among the elderly. A brain bleed is not a fun way to die, and neither is a broken hip.

Nursing homes will put someone in a wheelchair (my mother, for example) when the risk of falling is too great and/or the person is too stubborn to use their assistive devices like walkers. THAT'S how people get to be wheelchair-bound, not just because they did something that made them unable to walk anymore.

Maybe tell your stubborn and childish father than he should give up his glasses, because he should be too proud to use them, and you and the family won't bother picking him up when he next falls because you don't want to hurt his pride by picking him up like a baby. Tell him you will now consider him a DNR when he has a fall and needs to go to the hospital, because he clearly has no interest in living.

Sorry, that last paragraph is all sarcastic, but the first two are true. I hate these dumb arguments from people trying to fight natural aging. I'm so glad my folks didn't give us trouble about giving up driving or anything else because they had silly pride.

One thing that was suggested to me that I don’t see here - and which saved my dad’s life - was get evaluated for hypoxia (low oxygen). Those were the reasons for my dad’s falls. Now properly diagnosed, he no longer falls. He’s on oxygen and uses a walker. Now will that help with your dad’s stubbornness and pride? No, but perhaps the falls will stop. I can so relate, and feel for you.

My mother is 94.5 with advanced dementia, living in Memory Care AL. She started falling in 2016 when she was in the early stages of dementia, using a walker/rollater. She fell 40x while in AL, no matter what anybody did to prevent it, to help her, to stop her from falling, fell she did, over & over & over again, 40 times. She broke a few ribs in the process and a few sternum bones too, but nothing serious ever happened, and she never even took an ambulance ride to the ER as a result of a fall, believe it or not.

Now here we are, 5 years later. She's been wheelchair bound since 2019 when she went into Memory Care AL and I thought: Oh Thank God, she'll finally stop falling. Wrong I was yet again. She's now taken 38 more falls since June of 2019 while wheelchair bound and living in Memory Care, in spite of all the measures the MC has taken to prevent her from falling. Bed alarms, chair alarms, mats on the floor around her bed, signs posted in her room about PULL THE CORD BEFORE GETTING UP, you name it, it's been tried, all to no avail.

I could say, gee, if she lived with me, she wouldn't fall! But that would be a lie b/c my mother likes to do things Her Way. Her Way involves not following directions even before dementia became an issue. Now that dementia is a big issue and she's unable TO follow directions or process information, the falls are even more inevitable. If she were living with me, I'd be calling the 911 non-emergent # every time she fell b/c she weighs almost 200 lbs and nobody here is able to pick her up off the floor. True statement right there.

I understand dementia about as intimately as anyone who's been dealing with it for 5 straight years can understand it. I have the books, watch the videos, read the literature. I've contacted the medical professionals until the cows come home. In fact, my mother sees the doctor who comes into the MC at least once a week. Nothing works. NOTHING. Not one single solitary thing.

So my mother keeps falling & the staff keeps picking her up. Until she hits her head and has a brain bleed or breaks a hip or some other serious incident hurts her badly & sends her off to the ER, there's not a single thing I or anyone else can do about it. And, even after she does go to the ER/hospital & rehab for a serious fall, what happens afterward? The same thing: she continues to fall until the day she passes away, methinks. Thru no fault of mine or anyone else's, much as everyone would love to blame someone: there is nobody TO blame for such things. Except old age and dementia, but primarily old age.

Anyone telling you something different either doesn't truly understand the nature of elders who fall all the time or they're lying to you. Plain & simple. It's not your fault your father is falling. And there's nothing YOU can do to prevent it from happening. I'm here to tell you that. Because if there WAS something that could be done to prevent it, I and/or the staff at my mother's MC would have done it by now, trust me. It's not for lack of love or caring or giving a crap about the woman that she falls so much: it's b/c she's old, doesn't follow rules & has dementia that she falls.

Wishing you the best of luck dealing with the reality of the situation and accepting it for what it is.

joneseywales: Imho, perhaps your father needs to be seen by both a neurologist and a psychiatrist. Some elders resist using a walker 'because it makes them look old.' I am not saying that this is your father; it's just a statement made by some elders, ridiculously.

My grandma fell all the time. She fell in her apartment because she refused to use her walker at home. Everyone had multiple discussions with her about moving to assisted living. Grandma fell at the beginning of August. After the 3rd ER visit, she was admitted for pain management and evaluation for assisted living. On day 3, the hospital said she needed to go to skilled nursing. Shortly after, she threw up and aspirated. The next day, she had a lung infection. 24 hours later she was transferred to hospice. She passed away 6 days ago.

We wonder if she wasn't so stubborn and went to assisted living a few years ago, would she still be alive?

Initially, we brought up assisted living with her primary care provider. Because that's the doctor she would listen too. He didn't really want to address it. When she went to the ER for the third time, my mom told the hospital she was unsafe at home. That is what motivated the hospital to evaluate her. If she were still alive, the social worker from the hospitalital would have placed her in the skilled nursing facility of our choice.

Does your dad have a doctor that he trusts and will listen too? He might be more open if the discussion is with a medical professional.

Otherwise, you can always do what we did. When he has to go to the hospital, tell them he is unsafe at home. It may seem harsh, but don't feel bad about it.

No matter where he is though, he will still probably fall. At least in a memory care/nursing facility, there is someone around to evaluate him after.

Good luck and I feel you on the stubborn elderly family members.

You describe your dad as "wickedly stubborn". Yup - just wait for the big one. Clearly, you cannot force him to do anything.

I have dealt with frequent falls from a stubborn elder. It was scary enough as it was, but sliding out of bed was not a "fall" according to her. So these terrifying falls would happen and then I'd have elder looking at me like "What's the problem?" She could not get up on her own by any means and as another person described, she would kind of fight us in trying to help her. Had to call the fire dept multiple times for lift assist to the point where one paramedic would say to the other "she's in the system already." Most of the time, the falls were because she was simply not paying attention to what she was doing and/or she was attempting to do something that was too difficult for her - and she was like that all of her life. Didn't want to be told. And falling was far from her only problem in terms of living alone. One day, she had an unwitnessed fall with likely loss of consciousness during a short period of time that day when she was alone. Her life alert called the ambulance (it had falls detection). She went from the house, to the ER - where they were met by me (her primary caregiver) and I clearly introduced myself to the hospital staff and explained that she cannot live alone anymore. They admitted her to the hosp then transferred her to rehab. They attempted to discharge her to my care from the rehab, but I had to refuse to take her. Hard as that was to do, but this was not her first stint in rehab and the results hadn't lasted the previous time. She'd be a dream patient in rehab and then an entitled nightmare at home. She's in a NH now. At this point, there are no recent falls- - she's currently very confused and very weak and this is being addressed. I don't want to say she somehow forgot how to fall, but it's weird to me that she had multiple falls at the NH earlier in her journey there, but isn't having them now. I think maybe her drive to be "bad" isn't there right now and she's not attempting things she should not be doing and that's possibly the difference in why she's not falling now? Anyway, I was never upset at the nursing home for the falls. I know the lady and I know how stubborn she is. They can't restrain the patients or put a tray on their wheelchair, so falls are going to happen. Most of the falls would be a matter of her sliding to the floor. She's big, so they would have to use the hoyer to get her up and she would complain that it was embarrassing to have to do that, etc. etc. Next thing we knew... another fall. The only one that still bothers me was one fall that I was never told about (they are supposed to call you when there is a fall). I found out from the cleaning lady that there had been a recent fall.

Hi Joneseywales,
My dad is 92 and also will not prevent himself from falling...in fact he was almost proud of the fact that when he fell he would not even put his arms out to protect himself (it's supposed to be an 'instinct' to do that)...UNTIL I finally told him what a shame it would be if, in one of those falls, he became bedridden because of it or even paralyzed! He had never thought of it that way and since he prides himself on still being able to do things and not being dependent on people, he is now walking much more carefully and with his cane. He never worried about dying from a fall but I know he's scared of being confined to a bed or wheelchair. I hope this helps.

well first i would let someone know (doctor or whomever) know about him constantly falling and make sure the record that information. It would be awful for him to go somewhere and be all bruised up and someone at hospital or wherever file a report on elder abuse against you or anyone else in the family. Secondly I would hope that he is NOT driving since he has issues with falling. Disable the car somehow or get it removed from residence. Not much you can do if he doesn't want to use those items, however, let him know that IF he falls bad enough and has to go to ER.......he will NOT be coming back home but will be placed into a nursing home. maybe that will scare him enough........wishing you luck.

Almost four years ago started my father’s stubbornness in this very same way. He was diagnosed with dementia, and neuropathy, I took him to PT tried getting rid of the canes, buying nice walkers, rollanaters and convertible wheelchair walkers. I would find most of them hidden in a room or even the garage. Refused a lifeline button and couldn’t use the phone. (Hardly) It was frustrating and mind boggling since he worked for “ma bell” for 35 years and in retirement installed “lifeline” features on phones! I took him to two different PT programs, the first recommended the second because he was not improving there. The second place and I agreed there was nothing else that we could do for him if he wasn’t going to do it for himself. We thank God that his many falls throughout the years he hasn’t broken anything! Now he is in AL, still falling and still trying to hide the walker! I wish there was an easy answer, please keep on trying. I should have but we had other issues (his girlfriend/witch)which has totally destroyed my family’s lives is the biggest!

You say he lives at his own home, what do you do when he falls? Go over there and rescue him? Or can he get up on his own?

There is nothing on earth you can do or say to him to correct this problem. He is old, he most likely has dementia, and wants to remain in control - to his detriment. YOU should not continue to carry this horrible burden day after day until it destroys you and something horrible happens. It is too late to fix - you have to place him in a suitable facility where there is care for people like this - then you can have some peace.

I suppose reasoning is out the window since you've tried that. One attempt at reality perhaps. Ask him how many times he has fallen in the last week, month, two months. If the answer is right, you know his memory is good. If he realizes how often it happens, then just be frank with him: Eventually you are going to break something and it could mean you will be in a bed for the rest of your life. You will be transported out of this house to a hospital and then, if it's even possible, a rehab. However, you will never be the same. It is up to you. Use some of the equipment to help avoid a fall or when the gurney comes in to carry you out of here, there's a good chance you won't be able to return. AND you will be very unhappy.

I had a similar conversation with my grandmother when she was climbing on her roof to clear off the pine needles. She was mad that I said it, but I let her (as we say it) stew on it a while. I reminded her that she had always told me she wanted to wear out, not rust out and I took that to mean she didn't want to become bedridden over something that could have been prevented. Her goal was to keep moving, not sitting in a chair.

Before I left her house, she said if it would make me feel better, I could take the ladder with me. She gave in without really saying that she agreed with me. I took the ladder. I think it made her feel better to tell her neighbors that I took the ladder away than to acknowledge to them that she was too old to be climbing on a roof. She was always about working hard and doing things others didn't do because she was strong and not afraid to take chances.

In my experience most parents don’t want or like advice from their children. Is there a doctor or other professional that can talk to your Dad? I know my parents would do anything a medical professional told them. And my Dad especially needed to hear it from another man.