I hestitate to write this post because all of the advice has been given to me. Disengage. Delete messages. Change phone number. Let mother solve her own problems. Call police if she shows up.
We have tried for over 1.5 years to get her make a better decision, as have the rabbis, temple people, hotel people. She will not do anything but wake up and call me 5 times a day (350 blocked phonecalls), screaming and crying that I am a murderer.
Recognizing that she is ill, tried to get her a caregiver who could get her to a state where she could function. Tried to get her to seek help. STarted by sending her pictures of houses that we would buy her despite her terrible parenting and leaving the family at age 13. Terrible mother. Lifelong anxiety and narcissist.
If there is any advice I have missed, please let me know. Being told I am a murderer for standing by, when we've tried every day to do something but will not bring her near us or my son as we know how she acts and we know she wont' respect boundaries. Recall she won't settle down. Her list of demands for me is not only to be loved, but to fix her life, love her, feed her, nourish her, give her purpose. fix her face, get her to do yoga, go on walks with her, take her to temple, fix her teeth, get her massages, get her hair implants, help her start a business (all of which I have tried for decades). She writes horrible things like "would you rather I be murdered in Israel?" "You are murderer for standing by and watching me die." Police call won't do anything. Neither will Baker Act. I don't see how this ever recovers. I don't see how we dismiss the 3,000 emails showing her views of the world. On top of that she continues to regret her life and comment about how she shouldn't have married my dad, had children when she was young - all of these add insult to injury. I am really trying to not take people's time, but once a quarter, I feel like this isn't stopping. I guess you say that I have allowed it to continue. My mother is one of the worst cases of narcissism as someone has said, and she won't stop. I can delete, delete, delete, delete, but it is not so easy. I do get on with my day, but the weight is always there.
She wouldn't even take an iPad we offered. Wouldn't take the care giver. Told the caregiver to take her to buy a gun to shoot herself and then caregiver wouldn't go back.
She has a hoarding issue and can't spend her money.
So, yes, continue to delete and delete.
Hangs up on every phonecall. Won't call a doctor.
Won't take any of the help offered. People in Florida are now tiring of her. Rabbi has met her 60 times. She emails them daily too, but I am the only one being stalked.
Anything else to do but delete, delete, delete?
Face the thing you fear and overcome both your terror and your indecision.
You will have legal "standing" to get her help if she is stalking you in your own city, I believe. And you can say "no" in person while looking her in the eye.
Kidding of course.....
It's hard to get the police to take you seriously when you are giving money to your stalker. Why this OP can't get that through her head is beyond me.
Maybe the mother should move in with them too. Better yet OP should find a place in SanFran with her mother and they can live together. At least then son and husband will be at peace from this nonsense.
“ I want her to live in a nice condo on the water make friends …”
If I were to threaten suicide , cyber stalk you, tell you that the world owes me, and tell you that you are the only one that can help keep me alive …….
Will you buy me a condo on the water ??
I’d really like one .
Do you see how ridiculous this is ??
What Is Codependency?
Codependency refers to a complex emotional and behavioral condition that affects a person’s ability to have a healthy and mutually satisfying relationship. Codependency can affect a wide range of relationships including parents and children, siblings, friends, significant others or co-workers. It is not uncommon for the dependent party to additionally suffer from either a chronic mental illness or an addiction.
Relationships formed through codependency are often characterized as abusive, one-sided or emotionally destructive.
Signs of Codependency
Signs, symptoms and indicators of codependent behavior can include:
Poor boundaries with others
Low-self esteem
Caretaking
Obsessions
A need for control
Difficulty making decisions
Trouble identifying or communicating thoughts, feelings or needs
Chronic anger or strong, emotional reactions
An extreme need for approval or recognition
Denial of problems
Anxiety or fear about being rejected, judged or abandoned
Intimacy or relationship issues
Lying
I don't know if you are seriously this clueless, if you get some sort of perverse joy out of this dysfunctional, destructive relationship, or you're making all of this up for a cheap thrill. But I'm done wasting my time with this nonsense. If you can't - or won't - see that it's primarily YOUR behavior that has to change for this situation to rectify itself, then there's really nothing left to say.
And in the chance that all of this IS real, then I feel tremendously sorry for your husband and your son, especially your son. After all, your husband had a choice to not get involved with you, but your son has no choice in this whatsoever.
https://www.avg.com/en/signal/how-to-avoid-cyberstalkers
If a person was serious about that, in my opinion, a person would STOP paying for the phone that is used to stalk them.
"..I've been living in fear".
This is the real issue I think.
None of us really know what is happening here, the story seems so strange (but strange things DO happen).
If you are so fearful, please keep seeking help from your therapist.
If the idea that your Mother may move to your town has you this fearful, this is indeed a problem for you.
This older woman, who you claim can support herself financially for 4yrs is free to move where she wants.
Please THINK about why you are so fearful? If she moved into the next street? So what?
How would that change anything?
These fears are within you.
Cut her off .
You don't want your mother to go to jail for her illegal stalking.
You allowed your mother access to your son whom she is now stalking.
You refuse to cut her off and stop paying for her hotel, phone and other crap.
Stalking is illegal. There are laws against it. Whomever you are talking to is either ignorant or you are a liar and not telling the truth about your mother.
You still want to manage her so won't cut her off. You are doing a terrible job of mananging her and now your son is in danger of being sucked into this drama by the malignant psychopathic, narcissistic nut case. Good job mom. NOT.
I find it hard to believe you are a public figure and successful.
Good luck. The only one I feel sorry for is your son at this point.
If she gets to San Francisco, you don't let her into your house. If she harasses you, call the police. Get a restraining order. If she comes within a certain number of feet of you, u can call the cops. They will take her to jail. At that time you need to tell them she needs to be evaluated for a mental illness. You are afraid of her. You even say that your afraid she will harm someone. This is not a personality disorder. This is a person that is mentally ill. My MIL and SIL have personality disorders but neither of them would harm someone.
Your Moms life has been manipulating people. Thats how she led the life she did. I really don't understand why you keep allowing her to manipulate you. Didn't bother her that she left a husband and children to do whatever her little heart desired. Then when she no longer could have that lifestyle she came running back. You owe this woman nothing.
You must cut her off completely. Have your husband tell her coming to SF is not going to solve her problems. Because, she will not be living with you and she will not be getting any money from you. NONE. Not even $5 for McDonalds. That if the hotel she is staying at now is getting too much, Fla hasva lot of less expensive motels.
If you don't cut her off completely, I really don't know how else we can help you. At this point, you are now the problem. You seem to be afraid of her. You need help to deal with this.
For all that said blocking or changing would do any good - it won't.
I'm a public figure and she saw I was just in Japan.
I"m going to present at a conference in DC next week, it's public.
My business website and emails are on my website and changing will do nothing. I've blocked and blocked, but she'll just send using other avenues and will eventually start reaching out to random people on Linkedin, who comprise my membership.
She sits in her room all day and only thinks to send emails and voicemails to people because she CAN'T move.
The reason she doesn't outreach to my sister isn't because of money. My sister offered her to stay in one of her houses. The reason is because my mother doesn't like St. Louis. She was glamorous and only wants a nice life, not any life.
She has money in the bank and has said she will come to SF and use her own money if she has to - that would last about 3-4 years. SF is expensive, but she knows how to be frugal. Once she is here and up the street, it will be terrible. I guess I'll cross that bridge when I come to it but I've been living in fear.
All of this thinking I am doing to try to solve or manage my mother is for my son. She is now stalking him. She wants to see her Grandson! Her beloved grandson (who she has seen twice). She wants him and not her other grandchildren because he is the one who is smart and she knows he can do stuff for her. She now wants him to help her with her blog, walk her to the store to cure her agoraphobia etc.
Reading through the responses, you've gotten the advice you need. You can't control her, obviously. You can only control yourself and how you respond, and that is 100% up to you. 100%. Stop blaming her for YOUR reluctance to do what is necessary for you, your child, and your husband. It is your responsibility to protect your loved ones. She is not a loved one.
Engagement on your part is a tacit agreement that what she is doing is acceptable. Treat her like the stalker she is.
Zero contact is scary as I do want to manage her. While she is off the deep-end, she is not a complete psychopath (yet).
So the consensus for what OP should do is as follows:
1. Stop paying on your mother's phone. It will get shut off and mom can get a phone with her own money that she is greedily hoarding away.
2. Completely and 100% fully cut off ALL financial support to your mother. Not one more dime should be given to her.
3. Call FBI and report her for stalking interstate. Though I get why the authorities won't take you seriously since you are funding this mental patient every single month.
If you can't or won't do these 3 things then I guess one can conclude that you actually enjoy all of this negative attention from mom, after all it is the most attention she has paid you for your entire life as her daughter.
She doesn't stalk her other children because they don't give her money. Think about that. No money = no stalking.
No money does not equal no stalking. This isn't about money.
We offered her more money and to buy her a house. She doesn't want the money. She feels panicked and truly believes that I am the only one who can save her. She sends emails to the rabbi and local community people too. ONly begging them to call me.
You made a sick conclusion. I don't want my mother in jail as I would be afraid of what she would do when she gets out of jail. I also don't want her in jail. This also is not arrestable. We've talked to police multiple times.
I don't want or need my mother nor any attention. That is just sick thinking and if you were trying to make a point, it is wrong.
Not being willing to cut her off and maintain one line of communication is a judgment that it is the best thing for my family.
I have a thriving business, doting son and husband and I would be fine with no mother in my life. Calling FBI will do nothing. Filing a harassment order won't do anything.
And she doesn't stalk my sister because my sister was a crack addict and is low-class and lives in St. Louis. She doesn't want her life. She wants mine. Nothing to do with the money. She isn't asking for any money. She is panicked and doesn't see a good life ahead and I believe had a narcissist collapse.
Have you looked at a website called Out of the FOG?
I did find the Out of the Fog website!!!! I thought it was excellent with excellent tools.
Just STOP.
SO WHAT if she harms someone else? It's just NOT your problem. Not within your ability to control.
Anything you have to do with her is NOT improving the situation because her life is entirely within HER control, not yours. And she is manipulating your "generosity" (actually your fear and codependency) to the hilt
So stop already.
This IS the point, and you SHOULD care about the phone bill.
Not the ***monetary*** cost. This phone is costing you way, way more than just money. By continuing to pay it, you are signaling to your mother that you're NOT willing to cut ties. Not only that, but YOU'RE PROVIDING HER WITH AND FINANCING ONE OF THE TOOLS SHE'S USING TO CONTINUE TO HARASS YOU!
Do you know how crazy that is? Would you hand a gun to someone who was trying to rob you at knifepoint and tell them to use the gun instead because you're trying to keep them from harming you?
Remember what I said about strangers and indifference? Would you pay for a stranger's phone?
Have you sought help yet for this co-dependency? If mom is serious about moving to San Fran - and, quite frankly, if the hotels in FLA are too expensive, how does she propose to pay for living in San Fran, which I believe is the single most expensive place in all of the U.S.A. - you had better get help for this before she arrives, or you won't even have the narrow cushion of distance to offer you some semblance of protection.
Yes mom may get another phone with her own money but at least OP won't be financing her own abuse with it.
Until OP completely and fully cuts off the financial spigot this is going to continue until one of them is dead.
OP your mother is a parasite and a leech she will survive without the money you are giving her.
She can charm and cajole others to get some of her enormous needs met.
But you she sees as an extension of her self. And it is enraging to her that this "part of her" isn't under her control..
As one therapist explained it to me, its like having an essential body part-a hand, a foot, an a$$hole-that you can't control.
Read Liz Scheier's book and you'll have a sense of it.
Liz wasn't able to help her mother- but she DID protect herself and her family from her mother's lifetime of craziness.
So she shows up at your door. You don't let her in and you call 911.
And extremely glad that you have a therapist.
Your mother's actions, thoughts, desires and happiness are not within your locus of control. She is truly a leaf, floating downstream towards her destruction. There is not a d@mn thing you can do that will change her self-destructive behavior.
One thing, I would NOT tell her that you will turn the money back on if she behaves nicely. She isn't capable of that level of self-control. She is someone who has never developed emotionally past the enraged infant stage. She is an all-encompassing pit of neediness. That need can never be fulfilled.
Wishing you well.
Since you cut her off in June moneywise and she won't use her own money...then she is not paying the hotel? Credit cards have limits and she probably isn't paying so hopefully they have cut her off. This should all be coming to a head soon. The hotel will not allow her to stay there if they aren't getting paid.
I read your replies. THERE IS NO MORE YOU CAN DO. Seems like you have cut Mom off. You are just going to need to continue to delete, delete, delete since you will not change ur phone# or email address. DON'T READ just delete. If she won't use her own money, then the Hotel will have to evict her. At that time the management needs to call APS and tell them that they have a mentally ill woman they need to evict. Hopefully, at that point the State will take over this woman's care. You have done enough. Your mother needs help you cannot give her.
You will need to change your phone number (unfortunate but necessary), your email and maybe have your work press charges against your mother for harassment.
You can also report your mother's harassment via email to your service provider because email harassment is a crime. They can block her via her IP address. Also you will need to contact the FBI because she is stalking you interstate (you live in one state and she lives in another)
How to Report Online Abuse at the Federal Level
https://onlineharassmentfieldmanual.pen.org/federal-laws-online-harassment/
Lastly you will need to 100% cut off ALL ties with your mother. No money, no contact, no help. From this point on you will need to pretend that your mother is dead.
You may have to keep family members from knowing your new number and email so they don't give those to her also.
I'll just step 1: The WILL to break contact
But fixing her life, her hair, her teeth?
Find her love or rich husband? What next?
Financial help should be enough if you are willing to offer that it is up to you.
Can you disappear, lets say if you can work remotely go to different country for a while? I would seriously consider that.
Vancouver Island is beautiful, similar weather to San Francisco. Just saying.
Honestly reclaim your life.
Just for YOU?
OCDtrauma, you replied with a list of things you want. Valid things to want.
Please read your list over. All of it is about your Mother. About how you want her to act or change her behaviour.
Think about this.
You want a relationship where Mother stops harrassing you with calls, emails, threats. For her to uses the items you pay for, accept housing offers you may paid for.
*You want Mother to do things your way*.
Your Mother wants you to provide for all her needs, financial, social, emotional. Her requests are endless & unrealistic, yet this is what she wants. *She wants you to do things her way*.
It's the same. You are locked into this endless war. Until one of you makes changes.
You obviously READ her emails and LISTEN to her voicemails otherwise her "words wouldn't get stuck in your head".
Its "not easy " to change a phone number when all you have to do is call your service provider! It's easier, apparently, to be "stalked" by a mentally ill woman you have "compassion " for bc "she's still your mother."
Where is the compassion you SHOULD have for your husband and son who have put up with this nonsense for ages now, listening to nothing but excuses (like WE have) about why you "can't" do what any rational adult would have done AGES ago???
What happens when dh listens to your last excuse and files for divorce, taking your son with him when he leaves? Off to a calm and normal life for both of them, thankfully. It'll be to an empty house you utter your hollow excuses then, because nobody will be there to answer you. Is that what you want? Because that's where this nightmare you've created is heading.
I'm with Dolly. I am not posting again, I will scroll by as there is nothing that I or anyone else can say or do to get through to you, sadly. You've posted endlessly on this matter and do N O T H I NG to change the situation.
Until OP decides to fight back her monster, I mean her mother, will continue her psychological warfare on the OP.
In the spirit of Halloween I encourage you stand up to your mother and tell her off and cut her off financially. It's time!!!
FOLLOW THE ADVICE THAT HAS BEEN GIVEN TO YOU.
You can not help someone that does not want or realize she needs help.
You can not force someone to accept help that they need.
Unfortunately you have to wait until the bottom drops out of the bucket.
It is at that point that you have to decide if you are going to help pick up the pieces.
Truthfully it sounds like the bucket has had the bottom drop out at least once before and you picking up the pieces did little to solve the problem. So stop picking up the mess.
If she threatens suicide again call 911 and tell the dispatcher that she is threatening to do self harm.
If you feel as if you are being stalked file a report and get a restraining order. If that is violated call 911
Then I think, maybe this is not possible, that it is all made up by someone who lives in a fantasy world and has some major mental health issues.
IDK, but I do know, I am not posting again, I will scroll by as there is nothing that I or anyone else can do.
The moment you have an email from a new address, you will see in the preview the first few words that should give you enough information that it's her and you don't have to read it.
If she can't comment on your LinkedIn, what's the problem?
Don't listen to her voicemails. The moment you hear her voice, delete it.
Her rabbi is done with her! When is enough going to be enough for you?
I understand why u cannot change your phone#. I understand that blocking does not mean u still don't get VMs. If you don't know the number or u know its this woman, then delete. Don't listen to it. Emails, delete, don't read. Block. I so hope you have cut her off financially. You need to go cold turkey. If still paying, pay Hotel directly for a month. Tell the manager that you will no longer be supporting her. She has money and can use her own. If at any time he needs to evict her, he needs to call APS on a vulnerable mentally ill person. Let APS take over. Tell the manager this is your last call and he is not to call you or give out your #. You have been told to break all ties with this woman.
Mom has 100k in the bank. She can support herself. You can't try to help her in anyway. She does not know what she wants. Because she is MENTALLY ILL. Your DH can check for emails, delete and block and not tell you. The problem now is you. You give people like this an inch and they take a mile. You owe this woman nothing. She is only related by DNA. You have to let her go. I am sure you were told there was a book where a woman had to do this with her mother. You can't fix her. You can only try so long and then you STOP.