How do I protect myself from Adult Social Services?

The truth can be a tricky thing with people afflicted with dementia, especially when they are in the throes of paranoia. The truth they perceive may be far removed from reality. Not to worry you further, but her version of the truth may vary from day to day, even if she's not mad or intending to lie. Just something to think about for the next appointment. My mom can say the most awful things and then deny she said them five minutes later.

I'm glad the visit went so well! See what the council on aging has to say about in home caregivers for respite. You need to make sure that you get a break from each other and that you and your husband get some time together.

Everything went well. She told the truth. And that was that she was mad and took it out on me. He asked how we're getting along now and she said real good. He asked what the change was and I told him that I had been doing some research due to not knowing anything about the illness. That I gave her some money to keep in her purse because she likes to have some. And she told him that I explained about the money and why I was doing things the way I was. He explained to her that everyone does things different and that she needs to expect that not everything is going to be like it was. She told him that she trusts me and that she was sorry she took it out on me because she wants me to be with her.

I asked him if he had gotten the report back from APS yet and he said no not yet but he's sure every things fine and said he knew I've always taken good care of her (I've been taking her to all of her doctors .. heart, and him) for years. He said he just had to make sure because he has had patients whose caretakers were stealing. I told him I understood that he had to protect himself (I emphasized that lol) and her but it just sucks having to wonder if APS is going to keep showing up. He said he's not sure but he doesn't think they will.

So today was a good day. I just hope it stays this way but I know it won't.. And I did tell her on the way in to just tell the truth. So thank you for the advise. I truly appreciate it. I know we're going to have bad days again but I think now I'll be much more in tune to handle them better. It's a half hour drive to town so we were in gone awhile. After the appt I took her to McDonalds and did a bit of grocery shopping and by the time we were headed home her mind was back in limbo.

Now all I have to do is try to find someone I can trust to have come in and be with her so I can get out of the house. I guess I call the council on aging in my area? Anyway, thank you again.

Good luck!

I understand what you're saying. But I think we had a good talk. I just listened and tried to answer the best I could without making her scared. We talked about the bills etc. She is the one who told me what she's going ssay. They just called is in. Ill update later

Ly, you DO realize, that in the mind of a demented person, you ARE telling her what to say. "Just tell the truth mom" , would be a much more unambiguous message.

And honey, telling her that you would leave was NOT what I was advising you to do. I really think that the best you can do at this point is to tell the doctor that you don't feel like you are psychologically equipped to handle her care. Right niw, it seems like what you are doing is replaying a tape from your childhood. This is not healthy OR safe for anyone.

We have to leave in an hour. I just sat and talked to her and asked her what she plans on saying to the doctor. She said I'm not telling him anything. I told her pretty much what you said. I told her if she complains about me again I'll leave her there and come here pack my stuff and leave. The look on her face was priceless

Of course, you need to inform APS, as well as the doctor, that you are resigning as POA. Step back. Let the State care for her.

So, you go to the doctor tomorrow. And mom talks trash about you. You sigh. You put your head in your hands for 6 seconds. Then you sit up and straighten your shoulders. And you look the doctor in the eye and say, very calmly and in a very soft voice " well, there you have it, Doc. I'm a really inadequate caregiver to mom. So I'll leave the two of you to come up with a better plan. Bye". And then you get up and walk out. No drama. Don't look back. Just go home and pack her stuff to send wherever they tell you to.

You don't need to put up with this, do you?

I didn''t feel like dragging the papers out in front of my mother. Not that I'm hiding anything... there's nothing to hide but I know her... I've watched her deny signing things over and over and I just wanted the lady to leave. I did explain to her that they are a matter of public record. I had them recorded with the county so she is free to go there and read them.

My mom's doctor visit is tomorrow. I talked to her over and over about how her threats could backfire. So she says to my husband the day before yesterday... she's only gotta be nice to me till after we go to the doctor. Then told him I told her what to say to him.

I took her to get her hair done yesterday. She told the stylist that all I do is sleep all day (eye roll). I had pre-warned the lady that my mom's libel to say just about anything and what was going on. She's been doing my mom's hair for 30yrs. So I didn't say anything. But it was nice because it was the first time I could just go for a drive in ages. She was getting a perm so I was able to leave and know she would be fine. Sue is a great person.

I have no clue what's going to happen tomorrow but I know she's plotting. She always gets that "look" on her face. Yesterday I had to make her 3 different meals for dinner because she didn't like anything I made. The last thing I made I told her if she didn't want it to eat an egg. I keep boiled eggs in the fridge so she can grab one when she wants as long as she doesn't eat too many. She eats and sleeps all day. She wakes up at 4pm and I always know it's coming "I'm hungry". She knows I don't usually have dinner ready until 5 or 5:30.

I haven't felt good today so I've been sitting most the day in my little TV room so I know she's mad. Hub is grumpy today because of her telling him he never does anything. I'm trying to hold tight to my nerves but it's hard.

I just looked at the lady from APS business card. They are homemade printer cards. The attorney I consulted warned me about ppl coming around saying they are from Social Services making up their own cards. I don't think she was fake though due to her coming the very next day after the last appointment.

I want to quit. Not sure what to do right now.

lylwing, yeah, you can get off the defensive side any time! What mom says is not valid and you know it in your head but don't feel it in your heart. The mother bear thing is a good instinct but it can backfire sometimes. You wisely told hubby to blow off some of her irrational demands, and he is in a better position emotionally to do that since she is not HIS mom, but you may have to blow off some things too as best you can. "Consider the source" - and in your case the source, besides sadly being your own mother, is a woman with dementia and extremely poor social empathy and judgement, trying to hold on to any control she might have, and not even able to see that she is practically forcing the train off the tracks and making it more likely that exactly what she does NOT want to happen will happen.

Not clear why you would not show your papers (POAs, etc. I assume) to APS? That would probably help you and them. Possibly they understand that you see them as a threat for reasons that are beyond the usual, but they are only human and may not accept that as well if they see it as resistance or hiding something.

Frankly, you COULD threaten your mom right back - that APS will come and see that you have been taking care of things as well as she will let you and they will get on HER case, not yours. And if they come over again, FINE, you will bake muffins and have a pot of tea for them when they arrive. Or, maybe just fantasize about that :-) And while you are at it, see if they have any help for caregivers and spouses because the strain on your marriage is realistically considerable, and if any kind of counseling could help you two pull together it would be awesome and help innoculate you against mom's cruel ranting that is getting to you, as it would get to anyone. Maybe they even could offer a respite person to come over and give you an afternoon and evening out once a week for it, plus a little couples' time after.

I'm so sorry for your situation. My mother was very controlling but her mind only went literally a few hours before she became unconscious and died. My father has dementia. I've learned a few things dealing with him. First, for a while at least, he would desperately try to grab on to things that are normal and what he was used to. For your mom, that means she wants to go to the bank, answer the phone, make choices, and irritate you. That's what she's used to. She wants to feel normal. She probably doesn't understand what's happening to her clearly. As my dad progressed, he has become less interested in the things he wanted to do. He still empties the dishwasher, answers the phone (and yes, after waiting 9 months on a waiting list for a doctor for him, when they called, he answered and cancelled), walks up to get the mail, takes trash to the dump but he can no longer understand or bother to clean up things like food that he drops, look at the mail he collects, properly collect the trash, watch his favorite TV shows, or care that his truck leaks oil all over. We need a new truck but, until he agrees not to drive (and somehow with his "blind eyes," he passed his eye inspection last spring), it makes no sense to get a new truck that he could damage. He can't hold a conversation or even answer questions unless they are very simple. He sleeps 20 hours a day. He won't clean himself, clean his clothes (won't let me clean them because he's desperate for that little control of his life), or go to regular doctors (but will go to dentist, go figure). When he responds, half the time it's with "It don't matter." Life sucks!

Lyl, i have to be honest, i don't see this working out. Your mother, BEFORE she had dementia, w as a deeply dysfunctional person and an abusive parent. I think hands on caregiving is too much to be asked of you. Talk with APS and her docyor about plaving. Not as a threat, but because it's what's best for both of you.

I believe you are right. I think that is why I'm both scared and angry. I'm trying really hard to get past the anger I had with her. I left home when I was 15 because of her.It's never been talked about until a couple of weeks ago when she was trying to fight with me and she said "this is why I put you out". Really? lol I didn't say anything. I'm learning to just say "okay mom" when she says something mean.

So do I ask them to come back out? How do I get them to see more of what's going on? I'm trying to get her on video but she catches me nearly every time and shuts up.

Someone said I need to learn to STFU and I agree. I have to let that fear and anger go but it's so hard. It's harder when she talks shit about my husband. He's never done anything wrong to her. He works his ass off taking care of the yard and all that. D*mn she had him racking leaves when there was still snow on the ground. I told him he has to start telling her no or I'll do it later. He is now and it's working except she says stuff to me about him... I'l a mother bear when it comes to my family.

but anyway.... I said all that to say you are right LOL.

It is possible that you are afraid of the adult social services because your mom threatened you with social services when you were a kid. You want them to see the situation as much as possible so they will have the right picture of what's going on. It sounds like she needs to be in the care of someone who does not have your history with her. She is pushing your buttons because she programmed those buttons years ago

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I would think the doctor would understand. I didn't raise my voice but I did get defensive. When he said he was going to call APS I did get up and start crying. I said something to the effect of "I can't even defend myself? or you'll call APS?" I would think that he would know that patients with dementia lie or make things up and are paranoid. One of the things she said is that I went and bought a brand new car and bought my husband a brand new car. when APS came out I showed her my car a 2001 Dodge Neon and my husbands '99 pick up that is all banged up. Before my mom was diagnosed she wanted to buy a brand new car. I explained to her that the payments would be huge and that it would be better if she bought a used car...that's where the Neon came in. She took a loan out to pay for it but it only cost 1200 so I had enough to pay for the truck and put the extra in her bank account.

APS said I couldn't put a lock on the door even though I've read that's one of the things you should do as long as the locks are quickly accessible for emergency sake...she told me to put those alarm things on the doors so I would hear if they open. She "seemed" to understand that most of what mom said was a lie but I don't trust those type of people. She wanted to see my paperwork and I refused in a nice way. She doesn't need to see them and I was advised that I don't have to unless she has a warrant. but also warned to be careful not to ruffle feathers.

So today because my mom said my room is a mess which it's not even if it is so what the rest of the house is perfect clean..she told me that APS is coming out to look. Now she is holding this over my head. Yes, she is a complete narcissist and it's getting worse. She's trying to tear my marriage apart. She's constantly talking crap about me to my husband and saying things like "I don't know why you put up with her, you should just leave her," And the truth is that my marriage is stressed right now. My husband is tired of seeing me cry all of the time. He's tired of all the b/s going on. He's trying really hard to understand it all but right now he doesn't. I'm upset because I feel like I dragged him into this even though we talked about it before we moved in and he agreed and is telling me I didn't. We had planned to be traveling by now. We are both 50 and this is a time when we should be free. She's constantly crying and saying "How did I get such rotten children" "Why do all of my kids hate me". All of our lives she has pitted us against each other so none of us get along.

sorry I went off of the path a bit. I just have so much to vent about. Right now I'm doing some reading up on dementia. It's all making sense but it's still so hard. Oh and the refrigerator needs cleaned out so she says but it's fine so APS is going to come out. And she told my husband that I told her what to say to the doctor at her appointment this Thursday. I didn't. I haven't even spoke on it

APS could turn out to be your friend, and frankly, the guy told you you did not need a guardianship may have been dead wrong. Or maybe, as she is losing abilities to really plan and carry out anything financially or otherwise on her own, at this point your POA will do. But if she retains the right to change her POA, that could happen and might not be a good thing if she gives it to someone who wants to drain any resources she has instead of actually help care for her. And the doc who did not get it that mom has dementia and was making it all up did not quite handle it very well, unless what actually happened was that you were yelling at her in attempts to defend yourself. It's ironic that because you were afraid she would be believed, you could have inadvertently acted in way that made it believable that she was being abused, but that can happen. APS can usually smell phony accusations from a mile away - but they are not 100% on that, and any documentation you can manage will help. The truth is if you let her alone or don't "babyproof" and she does get hurt, that's when APS could fault you, not the other way around. I basically see where they are coming from with the phones - she should not be held entirely incommunicado if she needed to call for help; even though actually you are there full time, if anything were to happen to you she could not even dial 911. I do think some cell phones allow GPS tracking of their location too - though mostly for parents wanting whereabouts of their teenagers, the apps for that do exist.

SO - mom expects you to wait on her hand and foot now and feels it is justified, because she is still a narcissist at heart and now she is a narcissist with dementia. If she ever had any capacity for empathy for you or anyone else if may be gone now. She feels she can get her way with you because she could call APS again. Go to the social work people yourself, and ask their advice, and ask if there is any respite because she has become more demanding, does not want to eat, and needs 24 x 7 supervision, which one person realistically cannot do alone. You keep your cool and act pleasant and professional rather than freaked out by Mom and the APS involvement. THAT's what you do, much more than "protect myself form APS." Remember anyone can call in a report and it has to be investigated - but again, the report will be unfounded, and the more obvious that no abuse is happening, the quicker that will be done. A little surreptitious video or at least audio of her ranting or refusing to eat good food in front of her might not hurt in that regard.

If she is capable of comprehending anything, YOU need to put YOUR foot down.

If she's acting like a brat right now and doesn't want to eat dinner, so be it. She will not starve missing supper. Go about your business. If you plan on keeping mom at home, before she's too far gone, you need to really do hard ass homework on Alzheimers/Dementia or else you will not make it much longer...

Oh, baby proof the house. Make it where she isn't able to escape without you knowing... nice you have all the alarms, but if you have a gate outside, fix it so she can't get out that way either....

I will never forget the time my very own dear mother escaped and ran down the street hollering someone ( was going to kill her )...gasp!! I had just spent the last 2 hours doing her hair and nails... the mind is a curious thing.

Protect yourself.... let APS come in, who cares?... they'll leave you alone (hopefully) once they realize what really is going on.

Holy H*ll !!

Girl I feel terrible for you!! First things first, you MUST learn to STOP arguing with her. That will be your first big challenge. It's hard to just STFU, but if you learn this one, you're on your way...

If her doc diagnosed her with dementia, well then, he shouldn't be surprised at anything she says, at least my mother's doc wasn't. He usually just chuckled and said "Is that so"?... as far as ANY phones, I personally would take them away from her. She does not need them. If she's doing any sort of irregular stuff with them, then it becomes a hazard to both of you. You're there with her 24/7 (yikes), if she needs something or wants to talk to someone, I'm sure you will provide for her.

So today I was sleeping so she started snooping through my things. Which is fine. I have nothing to hide but its just the fact that she did it. And this is nothing new. She has done this all of my life. In fact most of things she is doing she has done all of my life... for instance lying. The only difference now is it has intensified. My husband was gone for 3 days ((lucky him). So he sat out in her living room and asked her how's she's doing. She went off on a rant about how I was so terrible to her while he was gone. She said I sat in my room the whole time. That is so not true. I sat in there with her and watched tv everyday as I normally do only longer. I wait on her hand and foot even though she is perfectly capable of doing lots of things. For example I have to make her plate of food, give her her insulin shot (she can do this herself) then she just sits the plate on her table and waits for me to pick it up. I get up in the morning and make coffee and take her sugar reading. She was writing down numbers out of her head. she is perfectly capable of doing it the correct way but she wants the attention. I make her cup of coffee. Which she can do. the list goes on. She won't get out of her chair except to use the bathroom and then she sometimes doesn't feel like it so she will pee in her chair. anyway she told him all kinds of things. So, I asked her why did she say those things....she said because your room is a mess. (it isn't). I said so my room is a mess and that's why you talk crap about me? She talks crap about me to anyone she can. She denied it of course. And then says I don't know why he runs back to you and tell you every thing I said. I told her it's called a relationship mom. we tell each other everything. So of course if you say something nasty about me he's going to tell me. She also told him that after we go to the doctor I'll start being mean to her again (I am not mean). I know this is part of the dementia. I know she's just trying to get attention and I know it's going to get worse. I'm just venting.

But here's the thing. She's now knows she has the upper hand on me. Which she lost until APS came over. Now she knows she can call them anytime she gets mad at me. She's always been a control freak. When I was little even at 5yrs old she would say things to me like if I don't clean my room she's going to leave and never come back or she would say that social services would take me away. She's always threatened me with stuff. And for a minute it was so nice that she couldn't. but now she can again. I keep telling her she's only hurting herself but she says she doesn't care.

For those of you who keep bringing up the nursing home. Please stop. I'm not using it for punishment or whatever. I simply reminded her of what the doctor said and it was only the one time. The part I didn't remind her of is that he told me with the way she is being so aggressive no home around here would take her. She would have to go to one in Detroit.

I wrote here to try and get an answer for how I can protect myself. I've gotten a couple of really good answers. One was harsh but I have read that persons responses on other threads so I expected that. I need support. Which is why I posted here. I'm so depressed I'm crying constantly. I have no help and no one to talk to. I left my home and friends to come here. I can't even go outside for a minute without her pulling something or saying something. She complains about everything. I'm at my wits end already and it's just the beginning. She watches everything we do. And she sits and plots. She plots on how she can destroy me. Why?

So anyway, I made her an appointment to get her hair done Wednesday. She gets her hair permed and trimmed. The lady who does it is just bought the business she worked at. So she needs all the appointments she can get. So now because my mom is mad because I asked her why she said what she did..... she wants me to cancel the appointment. She wouldn't eat her dinner and is is pretending to throw up, and pretending she is dead. Her next doctor appointment is Thursday. So I know she is planning on telling him a bunch of crap.

thank you for reading this

You can do 2 choices I can think of

1) Encourage social services to come over on multiple occasions, this will become legal proof in the future to show there is nothing wrong with the physical treatment you are providing your mother. It will also allow them to ask various questions to which no doubt she will answer differently every time, further adding proof that she is not all there to even know what is going on even in her own mind. It also gives a timeline needed in court should any of the bad siblings try to slander you in order to get her money, the social service people can be brought to court to be your witness that you have taken care of her, are not a drunk or abusive or whatever type of person, etc. that your other bad siblings or even your mother may state.

2) Hire a live in person for a while, that will allow your mother to put her madness on someone else so you remain sane yourself too, also it may remind her that going to home is the next step if she continually demands to be put in one. If her mind becomes so bad that it is 100% tormented by puppet spirits driving her to want to go to a nursing home, then let her be put in one for a month trial, you are not deserving of her torturing you daily in anger if she is not happy staying with you. You will go insane too in the end if there is no separation sometimes and warnings to her to control the puppet spirits driving her paranoia. She will see what the truth is by living by herself in the nursing home and most likely tell you to bring her out of it. Video tape her statements and let her watch them back in cases like this, it will help her question the puppet spirits that are deluding her.

I am so sorry you are going thru this TOO!! I know exactly how you feel..my dad had a massive stroke, and while he is physically able to do everything he needs to do..he now has dementia too.. He thought I was trying to kill him, and I put his ass in a nursing home...he was so paranoid of me, I was to scared I was going to end up in a bad spot with the state cause of APS... Sometimes, as much as we love our parents they need PROFESSIONAL CARE..I realized I was in over my head and could not handle the stress or dangers of taking care of someone that paranoid...

Good luck, don't be afraid to get her professional help.. Don't make it a punishment..

Remember that she cannot learn new things; she can do things she learned years ago. It sounds as if she will be needing fulltime professional care, but do NOT use the words "nursing home."

yes they have. And the caseworker could see a lot of things I was talking about are true but I don't trust them. thank you for letting me know that. I was really afraid. I'm also afraid of losing my mom. Things are better now. I'm trying to let go of past anger issues with her and remind myself life is my simpler if I'm more patient and talk to her about things. Last night I had her fold her own clothes. That made her feel better. It made me realize that I completely took over but some things I cannot let her do. such as her meds. she messes them up. but at the same time she wants catered to. It's only once in awhile she will want to do things like dust or fold her clothes. I know this post is haphazard but I know she is waking up in a minute and I'm trying to hurry LOL

P.S. You are not going to jail because even though Soc. Services does do some silly things, no way are they going to take care of your mom for you, they've already met her, right?

So good to know that you can still giggle! How are you doing tonight? It is 7:00 p.m. here in So. California. My husband and I are not on a strict schedule because we need to be flexible when the neighbor freezes up due to Parkinsons. So, we try for dinner at 8:00 p.m. I have been known to eat without him.

I understand landlines importance for emergency calls but she is never left alone. I have monitors set up all over the house so I can hear if she needs help. There's a second line in my area of the house. We have the living room where she is and have a what we call a tv room in the back of the house where I have sort of an office set up now and it's where I watch my shows at night. if there's an emergency I would know.

lol thank you for the giggle. And the sound advice. I never thought of having the calls forwarded. And the witness is great too. We have a neighbor who knows my mom and comes down to see her now and then..... they went though this for 10 yrs with his mother. My husband spoke to them about what's going on and they told him to have me come down and see them. I'm going to make a point of it. They are very nice people and I'm sure would gladly step up if I needed a witness.