What is the difference between tolerating a verbally abusive parent and a verbally abusive husband?

How sad you had to suffer abuse. I speak from experience when I say to you that no matter who it is that is causing abuse, and regardless of why, it matters not if it is God or the devil, NO ONE HAS ANY RIGHT EVER TO ABUSE ANOTHER PERSON. If every attempt has been made to stop the abuse and it continues, there is only ONE SOLUTION. The person who is being abused must, must, must get the inner strength to do what must be done. They must find a way to leave the abuser behind - no matter who it is or the relationship - walk away, never, ever look back. If you stay, it will continue and eventually you will be destroyed. It may be the hardest thing in the world to do but with time comes healing and maturity and wisdom and some day you will look back and realize it may have been horribly difficult but it was the wisest and best decision you ever made in your life.

Never, ever allow another human to abuse you - they are not worth your allowing them to do this to you. They are sick, evil, selfish people. I learned this far too late in life but once I did, my life improved.

Good for you in leaving your abusive husband! Do what you have to do concerning your mom. Abuse is abuse.

You can calmly tell your Mother that you will not take the verbal abuse. If she calls and you answer and she starts. Simply tell her..I am not going to listen until you can speak nicely..then you hang up.
If she leaves a message and you begin to listen and you find it abusive delete it do not even listen to the full message.
If you visit and she starts say you are not going to take the abuse and walk out.

It sounds like you did the right thing, the difficult and brave thing to leave an abusive marriage. If you were counseling someone and they gave you the same circumstances between you and how your mother treats you what would you tell them . It does not matter if the abuser is a parent, a spouse, a friend or significant other. Abuse is abuse and it can not nor should it be tolerated.
Why place yourself in a toxic situation just because the abuser happens to share DNA?

Sounds like she needs to be in a nursing home if she already needs some one to come to assist her 7 days a week.. and why are the grown children paying for this? I wouldn’t. The nursing home can do this for her and if she is drawing a social security check it will go to pay for the nursing home and if more money is needed then Medicaid can be filed on her behalf to pick up the rest but she has to be put in a Medicaid approved facility ...trust me I already checked into these things ... don’t drain your bank accounts.. also the nursing home rooms don’t have phones in them.. the patient would have to let the staff know when the patient needs to contact someone for something other than emergency ..

One you can walk away from and the other you would have to divorce .. abuse is abuse

I have learned from experience, the hard way, that abusive people very rarely change and become kind and loving and compassionate. So, are we to stand by and allow that abuse to make us miserable and destroy us, regardless who is doing it to us? Of course not. We have to stand up and say we are worth something and we do NOT deserve abuse and mean people in our lives. We must find the method and inner strength to remove ourselves from them in any way possible and never look back. I don't care why these people are "bad" - it is enough they are causing hurt and harm. They simply are not worth the time and effort and it is not your problem, anyway. So if someone is abusive to you, then YOU MUST REMOVE YOURSELF AND GET AWAY FROM THEM. Never allow anyone to destroy you and make you miserable. I endured this and it changed my life forever - the hurt, anger, and effect on me will never leave me. I did not deserve it. Now I will fight to the death if anyone ever tries to harm me again! You must look forward and leave NEGATIVITY BEHIND YOU. LIVE A GOOD LIFE WITHOUT THOSE ABUSIVE PEOPLE. DON'T LET THEM DESTROY YOU.

Mom's primary care doctor office called today and stated that he will be going out to see her on Wednesday of this week.

Thanks everyone for your input and caring.

statewise: I am glad to know that her doctor heard the rather unkind messages that she left on your answering machine.

That is great news. I hope he can calm her down. You don't deserve the unnecessary grief.

I talked to her primary care doctor this week and he heard the recorded messages she left on my answer machine. He is going to reevaluate her and let me know what she needs.

Thanks everyone for all your advice and support. It means a lot.

statewise;

Is mom not able to pay for assistance on her own? Why do the children pay for it? As her dementia progresses, she'll have to move to AL or MC. Some assistance is built into the cost, additional assistance will cost more. Is she going to be able to pay for this? As someone else noted, NH is NOT what mom needs. That is for those who require specialized nursing care that AL and MC will not provide. She is nowhere near needing that and it would likely make her even more cantankerous!!!

As for her behavior, whether it is long-standing or new due to dementia, you have choices to make:

1. If her voice messages begin with nastiness, delete it without listening to the whole message.

2. Don't discuss care for your husband or in-laws visiting. She doesn't need to know and can't complain about what she doesn't know! If she brings them up, tell her you haven't seen in-laws in months or years, and hubby is doing fine. End of discussion!

3. If she calls and starts being nasty, stop her and tell her if she continues, conversation is over, then hang up if she continues. Do not answer if she calls again, and if need be take the phone off the hook (cell phone, turn off sound, or "dismiss" call and let it go to voice mail.)

4. If she is nasty when you visit, bring someone else along. Sometimes having another person inhibits this. If not, tell her to be nice or you will leave. If she continues, leave. Someone else mentioned this and I have seen my mom behave much differently when "others" are around (have to keep up pretenses so the others are not aware of the dirty laundry!!)

5. If this is new behavior, it isn't easy but let the nasty comments roll off your back. YOU know what you do for her and YOU know her comments are unwarranted. Yes, it can be hurtful, but if you just chalk it up to dementia and let it slide, don't take it to heart, it'll get better and easier over time.

6. If this is old behavior, you can still try to let it slide. Before our mother developed dementia I finally told her one time that it hurt that she called me a freak when growing up. I know she had told me how her sisters had called her that. Her response? I don't remember that. Sure you don't, because it didn't hurt YOU! Some people have no idea how much they hurt you by things they say and do!

7. Attempt to change the discussion (refocus, redirect.) This does sometimes work with those who have dementia. If not, then make your excuses and leave.

8. Bring some little "treat" along, whether food/beverage item, special book, etc, that you know she likes. Focus is then on her and takes it off whatever she thinks is wrong/bad.

Although those with dementia often don't learn, repetition can sometimes work. If you draw that line with her (stop or I will leave/hangup) and follow through, it might eventually leave an impression. Someone mentioned it took about 3 months for their attempts to work! Final option is to reduce the number and length of visits. Stay STRONG!

Key take aways: Don't believe or dwell on her nasty comments and learn to walk away if she won't stop!

Did you seek out counseling for the ex husband, who was absive? Why are you footing the bill for your abusive mom's care? Don't engage in your mom's childish & abusive behavior.

If she is in assisted living why are u footing the bill for an aide? If she needs an aide then it sounds like it’s time for a nursing home.. the aides there are paid for by Medicare for her custodial care .. they have staff around the clock and access to the medical care also... as for the abuse... I have to put your physical and mental health first .. u have to protect your mental health and stay away from negativity ... been there before

your mother is jealous of your caring for your husband and not her. if you don't share anything with her that you know will cause issues she won't verbally lash out. if you can hear her starting even if you have not shared anything new re-direct or come up with an excuse and quickly get off the phone. if you want a relationship with her the only one you can change is yourself.

There is a difference of course and by the sounds of it there is also a big difference in time and both you and your mom's place/time in life. I would first ask and consider, was your mom always abusive? Often of course we choose an abusive spouse because it's what we know, what we feel comfortable with whether it be because we received similar abuse of some sort growing up or witnessed it between our parents. This of course doesn't mean your mom was the abuser or that she was the one abused, I'm just wondering if her treatment of you is new since she has advanced in age or if it's familiar to you as part of who she is and your life long relationship, that to me makes a difference. Many of our LO's take on meaner behavior or just become more direct which feels mean, others who have always had that edge in their personality can become really cruel and selfish but none of it, often, is a conscious thing or something they are planning, doing on purpose to hurt us more or at all, it's part of a disease process in the case of cognitive issues and sometimes pain, depression, life frustration or other imbalance. There could be lot's of reasons that aren't aimed as personally at you as it comes across and absolutely feels. The other possibility I see here is that your mom, if she has cognitive/memory impairment, may be thinking the husband you are caring for and referring to all the time, the one "taking you away from her" is the same first husband who was so abusive. She may not remember that you rid yourself of that toxic relationship (and good for you by the way!) she might just remember the feelings of pain and anguish a mother feels when they have to watch their child suffer, I think deep guttural feelings from times in our lives are easier to remember or just more ingrained in our beings than facts and time perspective for patients with memory issues. It would make sense to me that she would remember that feeling toward your "husband" when she hears about your husband if she has any memory impairment. They also often remember further into the past more clearly than things closer to the present which is why we hear caregivers here say all the time, your LO may be talking about a childhood home or place from long ago when they say "I want to go home". Even if your mom has always been hard on you and or abusive, it doesn't mean she wasn't furious and upset, protective of you, about the way your first husband treated you. If there is something else I have learned about family dynamics it's that parent's that could be considered abusive don't recognize that in themselves but are protective of their children and outraged by someone else, like a spouse being abusive to their child. Especially for those of us belonging to older generations, our parents generation had a very different perspective of "abuse" when it comes to their spouse and children, just because a parent was "mean" doesn't mean they were abusive to many older generations in particular.

None of this means you need to grin and bear it though. I would encourage you to try and receive it from a different perspective, maybe learn to re-direct your mom if you can't correct her, maybe enlist more family members or friends close to you both to help, talk up your current husband, fill in some of the time gaps so she doesn't feel alone so much (warranted or not, you could be there every day and she might still feel it's not enough). Maybe try to find a way to touch base with her, include her in your day electronically with one of these new and easy to use face to face devices. But if none of this works or you know it wont (this has been her personality all your life) set some better boundaries for yourself, be realistic and try to ignore the pointless hurtful stuff but don't cut her off completely, she is your mom and you obviously love her or you would have let it go long ago, it isn't the same as divorcing a spouse (hard) and I worry you will regret missing what time is left.

Get in the habit of noticing as soon as the disrespect starts. When you grow up with it, you don't realize that it is abuse. As an adult, you can teach yourself to detect the tone or subject and say “don’t talk to me that way” Takes a couple of goarounds, but it does sink in if the person realizes that you will end the conversation. When my mother loudly berated me on the front of the new neighbors by saying she could “pinch my head off” for misplacing the front door keys, I waited till we got inside to set the ground rules: nasty talk and I would say DTTMTW and I would leave. It was tricky because she would try to draw my husband into, “what’s wrong with her? and my favorite “she’s mad at me and I don’t know why”.

Oh, statewise, my heart goes out to you! Been there, done that... will always have the scars. Can't tell you what to do, but will share my experience (briefly) so you'll know you are not alone. My mom was abusive, verbally and emotionally, all my life. I had siblings, I was the youngest, and I seemed to be her primary target. She's gone now and I never knew why she seemed particularly irritated by my existence. When she started in on my kids, I drew a line and said no more. I tried to get her into counseling with me but her response, as always, was "Don't be ridiculous." I had to cut her out of our lives. Sadly, we were never reconciled, though I did reach out a few times over the last 20 years of her life. My mental health and ultimately my survival depended on staying away. I eventually realized her rejection had caused me to feel suicidal at least from the age of 6. Nobody deserves that. I also realize that she was herself a sick and unhappy woman. But I didn't break her and I couldn't fix her. I was finally able to forgive her (in my heart) and also forgive myself for not being whatever it was she wanted me to be. Sadly, I married a man just like her: critical, emotionally distant and never satisfied no matter how hard I tried to please him for over 20 years. What I finally learned is that if a boat is sinking you should save yourself, and try not to feel guilty about it. I wish you well.

I would block the phone for awhile. You need a break. You also dont need to tell your mother what is going on in your household. Dont need to tell her details about husbands care, no details about who is visiting, no details about anything. She will be jealous of anything you tell her, and come up with ways to use it against you. Stick to neutral topics. She asks person info dont answer, change subject. That doesnt work, you gotta run. See ya later.
Tell family you need a break. No one has to hear obsenities and or screaming on their phone. Doesnt matter who is doing it. You dont need ptsd on top of everything else. That is abuse and you dont accept abuse from anyone. FULL STOP.
I had to go no contact with my mom & sibling. They learned. Still have to do it from time to time. They try to go back to negative abuse patterns when I was young.

If your mom is smart enough to remember details about your life, she will soon learn what no contact means. Give her 1 warning. When she does it again there will be no satisfaction for her. No daughter to guilt trip. Phone blocked. No one to answer the phone or visit. She will learn. It might take a while but she will get it. You have to set boundries and mean it. Dont feel guilty bc you wont accept abuse. Family doesnt mean you have to accept it.

I don't see any difference between tolerating an abusive spouse and tolerating an abusive parent. Abuse is abuse. You do not owe anyone - including your mother - your health and wellbeing. Only you can put an end to it. You can start by cutting short visits and phone calls as soon as she becomes abusive. Don't listen to her nasty messages. If that doesn't work then you can end the relationship. Knowing that you pay for an aid will help you accept that you cannot be hands on with her because she's abusive.

Go to her next Dr appt with her. Type out all you have described and give to nurse to give to the Dr to read before he comes in the room. This is how I started the process of having my mother diagnosed with dementia by a professional and found someone for myself to discuss how to handle her.
She also can be put on medication to help mellow her out some.

My MIL can be abusive and demanding as well. It sounds like yours is worse. Sometimes mine is bad. If she starts getting nasty when on the phone I hang up and in person I leave. I limit the amount of time I visit and usually spend the visit cleaning up her place. I am finding that she does not care any more about keeping things clean, never picks anything up and never throws anything out. Her apartment is dirty. It is hard to clean things up because she does not want anything thrown out. Is this a common dementia symptom. She was a neat freak before. Does anybody else find that their parent is sick a lot after Christmas I am not sure if that is why she seems worse or not. Do most just sit around. Mine MIL is demanding and tries to tell me I should bring her the newspaper everyday. I just say no if she can't get it she does not need it. The store is very close by to her place. She does only go with another resident so she should not get lost.
I find it is best to talk to them when it is convenient for you and do not feel obligated to answer the phone.

I say no to leaving your mother, you only have one, BUT do not put up with bad verbally abuse, tell her to stop it right now, say you are going to hand up and not talk to her until she can talk nicer to you.  Worked with my mother-in-law, she did shape up overnight, when I told her no more and certain topics were off limits.
Be tough and stand up to her.  Its hard but I am treated better now.

I dont know if she was abusive before or if she understand she doing it, my mom was very abusive to me and I was her care taker out of 7 kids I was stuck after a while I face her and told her if she get abusive to me I was leaving and if I was talking on the phone I hang up on her... she call the next day and started it again so I hung up, she call back and said we got disconnected I said no I hung up because of your abusement and hung up again. It took her about 3 months to figure out what was going on she finally stop most of the abuse even if she started taking about someone else and it was abusive I would hang up then took my phone off the hook for a couple of hours.

Unfortunately, whether the abuse is intentional or caused by dementia, the result is the same. You are being abused and you do not have to tolerate it. You are suffering from the stress of the abuse, and it will get worse. In my opinion, you have the right to avoid abusive people whether they are family members or not. I know it's very difficult when the abusive person is a close family member, but you seem to have no choice if you want to live a life of freedom from abuse, have joy again, breathe freely again. My experience in doing so resulted in heavy weights lifted off my mind which resulted in energy, lightness, peace of mind, security. My first husband was physically and mentally abusive and I divorced him after 6 years. Like you, I never looked back. Now, my mother has been verbally and emotionally abusive to me for several years. I don't know whether it is dementia or just her lifelong negativity. It doesn't really matter because the result is the same. I have frequent but brief verbal contact with her, usually by phone. I told her I would hang up if she became abusive, and I do follow through with that. I stopped going to her house and driving her to appointments unless someone else is present because she is the sweet little old lady in front of others. It's not easy to do, but it has eliminated a lot of stress and heartbreak for me. I wish you the best of luck. I hope you can either cut the tie with your mother-in-law, or at least seriously limit the amount of time you in contact with her. In any event, you have the right NOT to be abused by anyone. If that means walking away, so be it.

The difference is as great as night and day, in my book.

I would not tolerate an abusive spouse, not for one minute. Now, my DH is as clueless in some regards as they come--but abusive? No. Never. I'd take clueless over mean any day of the week!

His mother is another story. She is abusive and by choice. She KNOWS what she's saying and she knows why. I have cut her out of my life completely--(realistically, I know that it truly impossible, but you know what I mean. I no longer make any attempt at a relationship with her and will not endeavor to do so--ever.)

My DH and I have had a rough marriage--probably not worse nor better than anyone else's really--we've just been together so long there's simply no romance nor magic anymore. We live together as brother and sister. And it's OK.

I have seem far too many women stay in abusive marriages for whatever reason they may have--one being "for the sake of the kids" and I can tell you, the kids wish you'd split up. I know my DH wished his parents had divorced 30 years before they finally did.

Abuse is never OK--but there are times when you do have to deal with it in some form. You cannot always walk away from the abusive person--often it's family and you simply HAVE to deal with them to a degree. But deal with them and walk away. It's hard to do, but necessary. (I'm thinking of my brother with whom my mother lives. I HAVE to get past him to see mother. He's toxic, but if I don't "play nice" I am cut off from contact from mother.)

Life is too short to have abusive people in it. I'm my own worst enemy in this regard. I am harder and more unkind to myself than any other person can be.

Maybe we start with ourselves and go from there?

If I don't like myself, I find I will allow others to treat me poorly.

Honestly, I think a lot depends on the degree of her dementia. Your ex-husband was in full control of his faculties, knew what he was saying and did so with intention. Can you say the same for your mom? Was she always this verbally abusive? I think is what informs your decision. If your mother is verbally abusive, knows that she is doing it, and either intends to be hurtful or doesn't care if she is hurtful, then you have a decision on what your breaking point is. But if her disease has progressed to the point of not controlling her outbursts or what she says, then I think you have to give her some slack or moderate how you respond to it. The difference is her ability to control what she says.

Whatever you decide, do not feel guilty for protecting yourself from abuse!

My father gets verbally abusive when he is having bad moments or depressed. I just finish what I am doing at that point, tell him I will come back later when he can stop being mean to me, and walk away. Thankfully this works with him. He has so far always felt bad and treats me super nice when I come back. I don’t expect apologies, as this has never been his way. But his recognition and regret of what he has done takes most of the sting away. The empathy of what he is going through, from being a strong independent man to being dependent, needy, and physically weak man, takes care of the rest of the hurt. I hope this helps. Good lick with your situation.

As I have been taking care of Mother 24/7 for the past 18 months, I have learned a lot about my childhood. We live our lives forward and understand it backwards. I see now how catty and passive aggressive she has always been. There was one time when I asked her why she was treating me bad, and she said, "Because I can." Rather than become reactive, I let it go, but now when she starts acting up, I remind her that MY mother always told me, "If you don't have something nice to say, then don't say anything at all." Oh, the look on her face the first time I said this!
I have had to tell Mother on more than one occasion that I'm taking a time out because I don't think we are being nice.

Very interesting Q! Also, a very important one.
Difficult enough to take care of one ailing, so trying to take care of two is a lot more difficult.
In the eyes of the Lord, your spouse and your children comes first. So, you are not wrong for caring for your husband. At no age are do we have any entitlement when it comes to what is needed or wanted even at 110 years, so if your mom needed to be where she is at, she may not like it, but there is a huge difference between caring for kids and caring for elderly. And it is not like you just threw her away; you are doing things for her. But I understand if you want to not go visit her with her abusing you. For her to understand you sacrifing your life caring for her is beyond challenging, so to respect you better. That, and hubby does come first, so for her to accept that. I am not great with words sometimes, so I do apologize for any confusion in my words. If you need to separate from her for awhile, I understand. You cannot be good to anyone unless you are good to yourself first. Plus, you may need counseling if you may have PTSD. If you believe in God, pray for peace and see what He would have you to do.